RS Minesweeper for review

[John R.]

This badge is on estand for sale by Richard and Realone asked for it to be reviewed for authenticity.

It is on hold for him pending the OK here.

John

[mrg]

Hi could really do with better pics of the front (eagle etc), but going off those looks good to me, with maybe a shortened blunted off pin. All the best

[mrg]

Here's mine for comparison

[Adrian]

It looks ok to me also, no red flags are jumping out. There is a flaw on the swastika that matches mrg's badge, the trimming looks the same. No issues for me.

[AndyC]

Its a original badge but the finish is not the same as on mrg badge


Andy

[BubbaZ]

What a beautiful RS you have mrg! Hard to find in such shape!

Coming back to RS posted by John - I think that there is a chance that the main pin has just been replaced not only shortened as mrg has said. Additional shot of reverse with pin in upright position would answer this question.
I cannot recall ever seeing such a big catch base plate in wartime produced RS minesweepers...
I enclose my RS for further comparison.
Cheers,
Hubert

[BubbaZ]

More pics.
H.

[BubbaZ]

And last two.
H.

[mrg]

Hi Hubert, thanks for the compliment, I wondered If the pin was a replacement but hard to tell without side shots, definately different to the standard pin. Excellent photos of your example wish I could get pictures like that.All the best

[juoneen]

The pin seems to have rust pitting typical of what may happen if worn wile on a ship. I have a minesweeper badge by a different maker, and it also has a rusty pin. Just an observation.

[Norm F]

I agree with Hubert and Gary, a good badge but with anomalies. That's a good pickup of Hubert's on the replaced pin.

These zinc Souval's can be found with either gilt or silvered reverses. In those with the gilt reverse, you usually see that the finish is absorbed or lost on the zinc reverse like on Hubert's, but retained on the hardware.

On the first badge however the gilding was lost on the hardware in contrast to the reverse, just the opposite of what you'd expect. Even without the side views on that badge, you can see the little dent in the back of the swastika where the end of the original pin used to dig in, and yet with the pin closed there's nothing there now. Furthermore, the reverse gilding covers that dent where you'd expect it to be worn off.

The intact gilding on the reverse and its texture is suspicious to me on such a heavily worn badge, leading me to wonder if all the gilding front and back has been re-applied.

Finally, as Hubert pointed out the large catch plate is atypical. Everything together suggests to me a heavily used badge that was repaired and re-finished and probably a long time ago since, as juoneen pointed out, there's a lot of wear to the replaced pin as well.

Best regards,
---Norm

[BubbaZ]

BTW - Norm, have you noticed that these silver finished RS minesweepers share right eagle wing stiriations with their close brothers marked WH for Wilhelm Hobacher?
Same city, almost identical dies, similiar finish and same odd stiriations on the reverse... that is interesting
Cheers,
Hubert

[BubbaZ]

marked and unmarked WH for comparison.
H.

[Richard]

This is my badge that I have for sale. I'll see if I can take some close up pictures of the catch and hinge and another with the pin up. Let me know if I can supply anything else in the way of photos.
Richard V

[Norm F]

BTW - Norm, have you noticed that these silver finished RS minesweepers share right eagle wing stiriations with their close brothers marked WH for Wilhelm Hobacher?
Same city, almost identical dies, similiar finish and same odd stiriations on the reverse... that is interesting
Cheers,
Hubert

Hi Hubert,

Yes indeed I had noticed that interesting fact.

It's clear there was some relationship. But isn't it odd that they have the identical striations and yet different raised outlines within which the hinge is mounted? You have to wonder what kind of tooling allows for different reverse dies but causes identical reverse striations. Perhaps closely related reverse dies from the same supplier?

Best regards,
---Norm