Tank Badge of the Legion Condor

[Robin Lumsden]

.............and the clip.

[Robin Lumsden]

Details of the leaves.

[AZartman]

Otto schickle type

Otto schickle style piece.

[FS154]

And here´s the complete set:

[Brian S]

Otto schickle style piece.

Yours is without question an Otto Shickle piece. No other LCTB has the provenance as this style to a period catalog that through analysis of the badge bit by bit proves the badge to be an exact match. Unfortunately you have politics, greed and avarice that have clouded the threads you alluded to leaving the collector not with good information but seeing how fragile the distinction is here between real and fake and that that distinction can often be a factor as to who's holding the badge and who's asking for opinions. Because you don't have twenty RKs bought from the big dealers makes this single LCTB no less real. Let anyone else come forward with a LCTB with such solid provenance, so far, none have surfaced. Pieces with blurry photos badly matched to uniforms but no clear concise match as yours.

[mmiller]

AZ,

Does the pin on your Badge have a dent in the middle? It could almost pass as a flattened area with a makermark imposed!

Regards,
Mark

[mmiller]

Hi Mark,

- early model, worn on LC uniform, could be the one proposed by Petersen few years ago.





jacques

Jacques,

I saw that badge at Petersen's shop, with award Doc and Photo of recipient. I think that George explained that the pin/hinge/catch were all repairs. The original attachment was horizontal and poorly made. It broke and the vertical assembly was attached. If you look very closely, you may see the two original attachment (solder) points on the rear of the badge. The left one is out from the second bone (as counting up) in the middle of the wreath. The one on the right is also in the second bone up (as counting from the bottom up), just below the cheek bone. You can still see the (heat) discoloration in the metal.

I ask myself ... why didn't I buy it! And with Award Doc.



Mark

[Don D.]

AZ,

Does the pin on your Badge have a dent in the middle? It could almost pass as a flattened area with a makermark imposed!

Regards,
Mark

Mark, if I remember correctly it is a silver content mark, 800.

[mmiller]

Mark, if I remember correctly it is a silver content mark, 800.

Hi Don,

Well that is what I was wondering. Nothing is mentioned in this thread, but a silver content stamp would 'fit' the speculations of LCTB lore.

Regards,
Mark

PS - I'm sure you remember seeing that Portuguese Badge in NCHS!

[Don D.]

There are two rather lengthy (and rancorous) threads on this type badge somewhere here.

[AZartman]

Mark, I hope this helps. Don is correct, it is silver marked/stamped 800. Below is information I posted from an old thread I started, and speaks to the testing I had done on this badge.

I would also refer you to post #106 of this old thread,
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...highlight=LCTB

I quote:

January 6, 2006

"I had the badge tested in two different ways, first by chemical scratch and acid test and second by an electronic surface testing in a machine. I only have a print out of the electronic test results as I cannot show you a print out of the chemical test results. That was done by hand today.

The chemical scratch test procedure was performed by a well known appraiser for the Antiques Road Show here in the U.S., named Mr. Zavian at Cluster Jewelers on 48th street in Manhattan in the heart of the jewelry/diamond district. He performed the test, and he has 60 years of experience at the jewelers bench. He stated it was coin silver from Europe at 800 or a bit above. It came back on the gray color level. (see below)

TESTING FOR SILVER

Scratch the piece to be tested over the surface of the black stone provided, press well so as to leave a LARGE AND THICK visible deposit, preferably a line of one to one-half inches long. Transfer a drop of the silver solution to the scratch made, The color reaction of the solution with the metal scratch will be as follows: (Take into consideration that the background of the test stone is black).
90%-100%= Creamy color
77%-90% = Gray color


I then went next door for electronic testing at Harold Wallace Precious Metal's Corporation, 27 West 47th street in Manhattan. They have the machine to perform a surface test using some sort of electronic sensing. They place it in a machine under vacuum and you wait two minutes and it shows a graph of the metals surface composition. Those results were as follows,

Cu 4.93 (wt%),
Zn 0.08 (wt%)
Ag [SILVER] 94.99 (wt%)

When I have a scanner available, I will post a scan of the test results.

Thus the electronic surface test showed a silver content higher then sterling 925. A purity of 95%.

What have we learned here?

First, for those who own a Condor Legion Badge, get it tested both ways and report back. That would be nice wouldn't it?

Second, we have a well respected jeweler and appraiser who has worked the bench for 60 years doing a chemical test on the item on a black stone and declaring it coin silver from Europe. He also has no self interest in the the item at all.

Third, we have an electronic machine performing a surface test declaring a purity of 95% silver. The machine clearly has no interest as well.

Funny isn't it? What have we resolved here?

Here are the facts.

• The badge is silver. The pin is stamped 800.
• Two different silver tests show different results in terms of purity level.
• The obverse closely matches known examples
• The badge's weight and construction material match other examples.
• The hinge and pin on said badge closely match several examples of Imperial era badges shown earlier in the thread.
• The badge closely resembles a badge printed in a known manufacturer's catalog , Otto Schickle.

I have done what I can.

Thanks to all.

Alex"

[Bob Hritz]

Here is an early type

[Bob Hritz]

Verso: early type

[Bob Hritz]

Hinge

[Bob Hritz]

Catch