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**Frank Heukemes** · 09-23-2005, 07:15 AM

I have visited Tim this summer in California and inquired about these IABs. Both badges and marks are very apparently original.
As I mentioned, the most likely explanation is that OM did not really make those (or BOTH of those), and bought them from other makers for distribution, just adding their mark.

I will drop him a note to check this thread.

**Andreas Klein** · 09-23-2005, 07:28 AM

There are still some questions marks in your explanation Frank. The maker mark is stamped into the backside of the rifle and shows the same bronze finish as the rest of the badge.

That's the proof that the badge was stamped before it got the final finish, but if OM bought them for their reselling business they imo would have bought ready-made bages ---- and than the stamping would damage the finish

I don't believe that a re-seller buys half done badges to do the final finish only to add their logo. If it is so than their must be more of them outthere.

**Tim Curley** · 09-23-2005, 07:31 AM

OM Marked IABs

Frank alerted me to this thread which I did not see as I did not get home until late yesterday. As soon as I saw someone refer to examples in Yuri's MILITARY ADVISOR article, I knew they were looking at examples from my collection.

I wish I had a good story for you concerning these 2 "OM" marked IABs, but I do not. Over the years I have picked up a lot of IABs, sometimes not in the best of shape, simply because they had interesting or unusual maker marks. I was not aware of the differences brought up in this thread when I first got them at different times.

I'll have to get these IABs out and take a harder look at them. Frank's explanation is as good as any I could come up with.

**Frank Heukemes** · 09-23-2005, 07:39 AM

@ak: most, or let's say practically ALL, unexplicable marks were added BEFORE the finish was applied but still, we cannot attribute them to the maker indicated by the mark.
These things remain a mystery for now and any explanation is a guess. But some sort of distribution between the businesses of the makers is the only explanation possible. But it is quite unlikely that an exotic, small maker like OM made BOTH these IABs with totally different dies and designs.

**greg.hays** · 09-23-2005, 02:10 PM

Well, thanks Tim and Frank. I honestly never caught this before, and if I had ever run into an OM badge of that type I might have passed on it.

**Philippe DB** · 09-23-2005, 02:31 PM

Hi Tim,

Thanks for the input.

Do you remember if you found these badges together?

How do they compare finish wise, difficult to tell from the pics we have because IMO colors are distorted on these pics. Is one indeed a bronze grade and the other a silver grade?

Personaly I find it rather interesting that both of these badges feature the exact same hinge. A hinge that is rather standard issue on the badge osted above but rather uncommon on the other OM marked IAB.

Just so everybody knows what I'm talking about here is Tim's second OM IAB

KR
Philippe

Attached Files

OM o.jpg (101.9 KB, 99 views)

**Philippe DB** · 09-23-2005, 02:32 PM

reverse

Attached Files

OM r.jpg (99.6 KB, 98 views)

**greg.hays** · 09-23-2005, 05:23 PM

Does anyone else see the two maker marks as being different on the 2 badges. Tim's first OM has a makers mark which is oblong and has rounded edges. His second badge (posted by Philippe) has a more square mark and the edges of the box are sharp as opposed to rounded. Or are my eyes as bad as the wife says they are

(she see's no difference and she is in IAB basic training right now

).

Where is Robert and his photo editing program

.

**Hans N** · 09-23-2005, 06:45 PM

Originally posted by greg.hays

Does anyone else see the two maker marks as being different on the 2 badges. Tim's first OM has a makers mark which is oblong and has rounded edges. His second badge (posted by Philippe) has a more square mark and the edges of the box are sharp as opposed to rounded. Or are my eyes as bad as the wife says they are

(she see's no difference and she is in IAB basic training right now

).

Good eyesight Greg

Frankly i have never been that convinced about this so called maker my self to be honest. I can´t put my finger on why but i have a bad gut feeling about them.

I am not going to speculate about these, others can do that.

Have anyone else seen other types of badges makermarked [OM]?

**Frank Heukemes** · 09-24-2005, 02:07 AM

Frankly i have never been that convinced about this so called maker my self to be honest. I can´t put my finger on why but i have a bad gut feeling about them.

Oh please, Hans, careful with remarks like these. There are OM pilots badges which have appeared in untouched Luftwaffe groupings straight from vets, so this is what this discussion should NOT be about. Looking at Tim's two IABs, originality is not the question here. I do not think experienced collectors would even participate in this discussion if there would be any doubt about that.

**Hans N** · 09-24-2005, 04:02 AM

Originally posted by Frank Heukemes

Oh please, Hans, careful with remarks like these. There are OM pilots badges which have appeared in untouched Luftwaffe groupings straight from vets, so this is what this discussion should NOT be about. Looking at Tim's two IABs, originality is not the question here. I do not think experienced collectors would even participate in this discussion if there would be any doubt about that.

Dear Frank,

i was refering to the IAB´s. I did a search on this maker and have seen those LW badges, they look very good in my eyes but they are not my field of collecting.

Why do we have 2 different IAB´s with 2 different styled MM´s as pointed out by Greg? The LW badges i have seen have only one type of MM. Furthermore, why are the MM on the LW badges so deep struck and on the IAB´s so shallow?

Somehow i just knew that you would react on my reply Frank.

**Frank Heukemes** · 09-24-2005, 04:34 AM

Somehow i just knew that you would react on my reply Frank.

That is because your remark provokes reaction. It just cannot be left in this thread uncommented. Sometimes (ideally always) one has to look at the whole picture before general remarks about a maker are vented. The IAB world cannot be regarded as a seperate universe.

**Frank Heukemes** · 09-24-2005, 04:52 AM

Additionally, I would like to entertain explanations where these two marks are different from each other. There are some factors which might distort people's vision:

-different lighting
-different depth of the strike
-different angle of the scan
-different angle of the stamp as it was held in place before the strike

If one considers all these, the stamps are in my opinion not different from each other. As an example, refer to longer bootom of letter O. Maybe Tim can look at these with a loupe and confirm.

Attached Files

OM-1marka.jpg (62.6 KB, 84 views)

**Frank Heukemes** · 09-24-2005, 04:52 AM

.

Attached Files

OM-1markb.jpg (67.6 KB, 84 views)

**Hans N** · 09-24-2005, 07:06 AM

There are some differences in MM if compared to the LW badges (if one looks to the whole picture as i have been told). There is a space between the letters O and M on the LW badges, this features can´t be found on the IAB´s. And as i previously said, the LW badges MM looks deeper struck to me and are more squared as well.Here are 4 MM´s from 4 different LW badges by the mysterious OM maker.

Attached Files

[OM] mm.JPG (20.2 KB, 80 views)

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