12th ss hitlerjugend ID disk good?

[Daniele C]

Wot about this??

http://www.germanmilitaria.com/Waffe...os/S30855.html

[Gaspare]

Just imagine..It took appromox. 30 stamp strikes to make just one side of this tag!

[Baronvlad]

Its expensive enough, does anyone know if the cord which is attached is what soldiers actually wore these round their necks with ? I have a GD one on a similar type of cord.

[mr.dogtag]

Well, actually the cord looks most authentic of the whole item.
These were made of asbestos and were actually used with stainless steel tags. Also a metal tube cramped on the cord to connect both ends is correct for this type.
I also think that this tag might be ok. The fact is stamped letter by letter is very common for instance for Latvian SS dog tags, and I would say they contain far more characters than this one. However I never came across another like this one and the only HJ tags I know are SS-Pz.Gren.Ers.u.Ausb.Btl.12.
Regards
Al
p.s. I'm sure only about one thing - authentic or not - far overpriced
p.s.2. Oh and one more thing - SS-Polizei tag sold on the same website looks more than very suspicious to me.

[Matt L]

Just imagine..It took appromox. 30 stamp strikes to make just one side of this tag!

I've got a WWI disc that has double that- 58 characters on each side of the front and a further 18 on each side of the back too... 158 stamps on the one disc... seems crazy for pieces that have to be made in the hundreds or thousands at a time...

[Matt L]

I have one issue with that supposedly 'Hitlerjugend' disc- the lettering appears to match this supposed Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 5 disc:



Matching lettering on discs from very different units, as I've probably said a million times now , is something that makes me very wary...

[Gaspare]

Matt, yeah , the Pz looks the same..But they are a very generic font..Something that's probably still available today...

"158 stamps on the one disc"

Good lord! 158 strikes! Any you guys ever try and stamp a steel or zinc tag? I say try because the first few I did I ruined! Too deep, miss stamp, crooked, too light, etc. Wow its no wonder they lost the war,,instead of fighting they were too busy making up tags!

[Matt L]

Maybe, but the 't' is the same too as is the quite unusual square dot with pointed corners. The serial number that's supposed to be on the back of this "HJ" disc is three- I'd bet it matches the Kompanie number of the Panzer-Ersatz disc...

[mr.dogtag]

Hi,
I wouldn't go to far. This font is very typical for end of war. Lots of tags are stamped in this manner. Also square dots are pretty common. The letter t is different and I wouldnt really say these 2 tags were stamped with the same set of stamping tools.
Al

[mr.dogtag]

BTW. To those of you guys collecting SB &WP - could you kindly check what tags were SS "HJ" boys wearing and give us some help please.
I belive that Pz.Gren.E&A Btl. 12 will be the most frequent indication, however I belive that some tags were also issued in the Div itself.
Regards + Thanx
Al

[Daniele C]

HI Al then u think the tag is good even if overpriced?

Dan

[mr.dogtag]

Well,
I'm lost somewhere between 'yes' and 'no'
Generally I don't see much wrong things about it. However as with most of SS tags on the market one needs to be very carefull.
Good:
- cord (this type is rather rare or even very rare)
- Typoeface is ok and not very common with fakes
- The unit is spelled properly.
- Bloodgroup and number is stamped on reverse unlike most of the SS fakes
- nice rust under the cord (just try to get stainless tag rusty )

Bad:
- Combat unit tags for W-SS are extremly rare, most of the guys went through replacement units. However they are faked most commonly
- I never came across another HJ tag with combat unit indicated ( but for sure I didn't came across lots and lots of tags - so excuse me for my vanity ).

Regards
Al

[Tommaso]

If it's really a fake I would say it's quite a strange thing...
usually the items from that website are ok, at least the most of them, and I use to trust Peter AT ALL regarding the SS stuff.

Cheers
T

[Matt L]

Hi,
I wouldn't go to far. This font is very typical for end of war. Lots of tags are stamped in this manner. Also square dots are pretty common. The letter t is different and I wouldnt really say these 2 tags were stamped with the same set of stamping tools.
Al

They sure look identical to me:

From the bottom text



From the top text



And my point was not that square dots are not a good thing, but identical lettering with identical square dots is getting a little dubious...

Unless, of course, you have discs you know are 100% authentic that have this exact same text Al or have reason to contest the idea that no two discs from very different units should never have identical lettering.

[Matt L]

If it's really a fake I would say it's quite a strange thing...
usually the items from that website are ok, at least the most of them, and I use to trust Peter AT ALL regarding the SS stuff.

But once again, no one can be expert in EVERYTHING. He seems to sell anything and everything militaria, not just Erkennungsmarken. Even the most reputable dealers can make mistakes and I've seen clear junk on good sellers' sites before; surely not intentional, but the pieces were fakes nonetheless. Not to say for sure this one is- I just have issues with it