The Assmann Schinkel-Old

[Bernie Brule]

Trevor,

Have you ever thought of writing a reference book on EKs? Thanks for your expert contribution to the iron cross collecting community.

Bernie

[Snni]

Trevor,

Have you ever thought of writing a reference book on EKs? Thanks for your expert contribution to the iron cross collecting community.

Bernie

I would like to sign up for one
I love to read Trevors threads about the crosses. Very helpfull to many collectors.

[streptile]

Andreas, Ryan, Kevin, Bernie and Sonny,

Thank you for the nice words, I am very happy you enjoyed the read.

I want to say that I did not do this research alone; not even the original idea was mine. Rather it was my friend Oliver's, and he posted it on another forum over two years ago. Other friends, especially Ben, helped, emailed back and forth, and discussed the possibilities throughout the time I was looking into this. George Stimson in particular helped me by looking over an early version of these findings (I had originally tried to link the cross I show in post 2 to Assmann) and pointing out some problems. I just found the moment right to tie all this evidence together into one narrative, and put it up on the forum, since a few of these crosses have been posted recently.

Have you ever thought of writing a reference book on EKs?

Thanks Bernie, but no, I haven't. There is a superb reference already available for EK1s, and an EK2 version in the works. I could never do any better.

[AFF96]

This well researched and very succinctly explained subject matter is a amazing!
Thank you Trevor!!
WoW!
Greg

[Douglas 5]

Nice done presentation identifying this 39 Schinkel version being made by Assmann .

Cheers , Douglas

[streptile]

Hi Greg,

Thank you for the nice reply.

Douglas,

Nice to get a positive response from another EK researcher

[Hans Kondor]

Awesome thread!
I have one question(maybe a stupid one sorry for that), these crosses should be a very early variants, but where are the mid and late war crosses?
Assmann produced awards till end of the war, made different design even the very ending, but I don't remember any kind of cross which looks similar to these ones.
There should be a standard design Assmann cross, with similar date, frame and small swastika isn't it?

[streptile]

Awesome thread!
I have one question(maybe a stupid one sorry for that), these crosses should be a very early variants, but where are the mid and late war crosses?

Hi Hans,

Thanks for reading. My only thought is that Assmann applied for LdO licenses for various awards. They were granted them for some, but not for this terrible quality EK. So after 1940-ish, they made plenty of other awards, but no EKs, as they had no license to do so. Of course this is entirely speculative.

Now I have a question:

Are other early Assmann badges good quality? Or bad? What else did Assmann make from the early war until the end of the war (Pilot's Badges, etc.)?

[Hans Kondor]

Are other early Assmann badges good quality? Or bad? What else did Assmann make from the early war until the end of the war (Pilot's Badges, etc.)?

At the beginning they made cupal PAB which is my opinion a very nice and high quality badge amongst PABs. After that they changed it to hollow zinc variants.
About GABs, first versions were made from hollow steel than solid zinc.
First IABs were also different, first hollow zinc later solid zinc.

Assmann was one of the first luftwaffe badges maker IMO with Juncker. Made badges even before the war. Pilot badges, Observer, ROAG, Paratrooper, flak etc.
Early variants are usually all high quality and very nice designed badges, some of them were made from aluminium.
Near the end of the war Assmann also produced LDO marked paratrooper, and pilot badges.

[streptile]

Hi Hans,

Thank you for the information.

In a way, the fact that Assmann made high-quality products before the institution of the LdO could be thought of as some small evidence weighing against this theory presented here.

It could also be that Assmann wasn't tooled-up to make the Iron Cross, and that these types were simply retailed by Assmann. This is always a very real possibility to consider, and I know there are others who think this likely.

[ben bijker]

Trevor, a nice thread about these early, ugly crosses.

I am one of those that are not convinced that Assmann made these ek's, I think these are Schauerte & Hofeld made crosses.
Not only is the style of the date pretty similar, they also used the same hardware.
All 3 SB shown have a silver-plated core.

Let's start with te SB's....

The Schinkel (complete) weighs 17 gramm, both L54 17.4

From left to right:
L54 marked, 2-piece SB
Schinkel 2 piece SB
L54 marked with regular SB

[ben bijker]

Reverse

[ben bijker]

Now the PB's.
from left to right:
schinkel (magnetic ) 13.8 gr.
schinkel zinc 11.5 gr.
L/54 15.7 gr.
the weight of the L/54 is high because of the lump of solder and the big copper "catch"

[ben bijker]

L/54 (odd mark, not incuse relief as usual)

[ben bijker]

I know it's no proof that S&H made the early crosses, but both the early L54 (without / ) and the schinkels are very thin.

S&H made crosses for the rest of the war (I think) and also supplied cores to at least one other maker (L/57)

That is why I think that S&H made these, not Assmann.....

Ben