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Psychedelic EKI

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    #31
    That is now even stranger .,
    Just think about it : Exposed bare iron would have clearly rusted by now - 60 + years ... unless the paint came off yesterday ?! The surface has to be plated/coated - the covered iron core will still atract a magnet !

    Now if it was just one coat of paint - with some components therin - contracted on that surface - seperated ? - and as can be seen - the rest of the paint did not bond well at all ... letting the paint to crumble/flake off over time .

    Or if we have 2 separetly applied layers of paint .... which you think/indicated it is . The brown paint - lets asume is some kind of primer to make the black paint adhere to the surface !! .... Some reaction/incompatabilty of the 2 paints could have taken place . The black paint disolving the brown paint ??
    this 2nd one is a more likely senario . .... as core -paint problems existed from day one .

    "... silver surface ..." should have been 'silvery surface '... looking like silver , ...

    Now looking at the picture : No rust shiny silvery surface - magnetic core :
    Only 2 posibilities --- some Ni/aloy coated core ..... or even a sold Ni core .
    Exposed ' ... raw iron ...' will and has to rust !! Generaly speaking - solid Ni cores exist and are rare ..., so I still think it is the common Ni plated core you got there .

    Cheers Douglas

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      #32
      I think the maker of this cross was L.S.D!!

      Comment


        #33
        Sam> Painted by Dalí

        Douglas> It got a strong magnetic pull. Core is more flat grey than shiny. Naked Iron will not rust if kept in a dry place.

        Went over the core again with a 20X loupe. There's a patch of rust to the left of swaz that has been killed. It got the same color as the rest of core, only pitted. If the core was plated with any kind of alloy it would have shown around the rust spot.

        Checked an K&Q EKII that also got lots of veins, it's in the paint and not rust.

        Why would rust form under several layers of paint and in that pattern?

        No 1914 nor 1870 EK i saw so far had any veining at all. Only 1939 EK's shows this trait, why?

        Not all makers of 1939's got veins, only some. Why?

        Because only some makers in WWII used the primer that made the veins. Veins has been on the crosses since they were new.

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          #34
          I really like it! What a unique piece!!

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            #35
            thats paint.
            result of temperature warm / cold in 70 Years...
            art design!

            Comment


              #36
              Carl ... once you said the bare metal is more of a flat grey and not shiny ...then I knew what we had here . Part of the core pre painting preparation : .... is 'acid treating' of the iron cores to retard rusting . This always gives the surface a geyish tone/color . I pulled up another sample that shows this nicely as well . It too has paint flaking off which seams to be a common side effect . As this brown veining appears to be on top of this grey surface ... some kind of reaction of the paints/layers or to the treated metal itself ???
              Even this one has the small paint chips and this veining and same visual behavior starting at the bottom around the date ! Almost like the paint or componants within are rusting/seperating and not the core itself is rusting .
              Two different types of veining indeed . Veining with different causes which one probably can not always properly distinquish . This also may exsplain the few only we find as material and chemical became impossible to get as the war progressed . I would say a short lived/used preparation that had to dropped giving way to straight core painting .

              Cheers, Douglas
              Attached Files

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                #37
                Any chance for a rear shot of this cross please?

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                  #38
                  I'll try get some. It got standard CFZ hardware, marked with 20 on inside of needle.

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                    #39
                    Reverse and '20' mm.
                    Attached Files

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Please, need lots of help!

                      Had this cross for sale on Swedish eBay (Tradera) for some time. It's allowed to sell Third Reich items there as long it's Period made. Some "collector" or dealer decided to report the cross as an "reproduction of coin, bill or stamp" and of course the "knowledgable staff" at Traderas Security Division closed it down. Included in the auction was a link to this thread. Even had the same pics in auction as here. Now they want a "expert dealer" COA to verify the cross but they can not give me a name of an "expert dealer".

                      My question is, can a Zimmermann be any more textbook than this?

                      Please give your opinions, if Tradera will not accept genuine collectors, not profitable dealers, from one of the worlds leading forums i do not know what to do.
                      Last edited by Roglebk; 10-22-2012, 11:33 AM.

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                        #41
                        That is absurd. This is a totally correct, 100% period, pre-1945 Zimmermann Iron Cross made in Germany.
                        Best regards,
                        Streptile

                        Looking for ROUND BUTTON 1939 EK1 Spange cases (LDO or PKZ)

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                          #42
                          Originally posted by streptile View Post
                          That is absurd. This is a totally correct, 100% period, pre-1945 Zimmermann Iron Cross made in Germany.
                          Thanks! It sure is absurd. Wonder if any of the sellers i emailed about fakes there is trying to get revenge in some weird way. Tradera sure is filled with crap, since selling 'newly produced TR items' is prohibited all TR items there is sold as "original".

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                            #43
                            ..always happens that a fake is confused as a good one..
                            in our case we have a 100% genuine and well known iron cross (and there are a lot to compare everywhere - international dealers, databases, books.. ).
                            If the world considere them as original how can someone else, unexpert, say a different thing ?

                            Comment


                              #44
                              It really is a joke.

                              Tradera is FILLED with fakes and they never get closed down, and they shut down the only original cross?

                              Take a look at these fakes, These they keep? :

                              http://www.tradera.com/-tysk-ss-hjal...2207_166386492

                              http://www.tradera.com/militara-meda...2201_166758321

                              http://www.tradera.com/ww2-tyskland-...2201_166786674

                              http://www.tradera.com/allgemeine-ss...2209_166708987


                              I could go on forever....

                              Comment


                                #45
                                Originally posted by Daniel.S View Post
                                It really is a joke.

                                Tradera is FILLED with fakes and they never get closed down, and they shut down the only original cross?

                                Take a look at these fakes, These they keep? :

                                http://www.tradera.com/-tysk-ss-hjal...2207_166386492

                                http://www.tradera.com/militara-meda...2201_166758321

                                http://www.tradera.com/ww2-tyskland-...2201_166786674

                                http://www.tradera.com/allgemeine-ss...2209_166708987


                                I could go on forever....
                                I could not agree more. Tradera is just as ebay a dump for junk. And the original stuff goes always for way more money then they are worth.
                                I never buy from tradera though but when I started collecting about 4-5 years ago I bought my two first medals there, an EK2 and a kvk2, and they where good but now you have to search really good for finding something original there. Just like ebay...But wait...Ebay owns tradera


                                Carl:Sorry to hear that your cross was "suspended", I followed your auction. But I´m not surprised that they closed it. The staff on tradera is a bunch of idiots. I also once put out an original badge there and though
                                they closed my auction too, not because someone had reported it as a fake, but therefore ALL items that was "nazi" must have a COA (!) And I emailed back and answered from who? And I also said that they had a lot of fakes on their sight at the time, that did not have any COA (and could not get one either because they were fakes), and why they don´t close those auctions too, I gave them many examples and gave them links to the fake badges/medals on tradera but they never responded. I guess they got cold feets and did not want to loose so many profits on all those auctions...

                                /Mike
                                Last edited by Badto666; 10-23-2012, 04:54 AM.

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