Knight´s Cross "4"

[Brian S]

Big grin for what ?????????????, sure it is Glunz with Oberleutnant tabs !

yours friendly

Eric-Jan Bakker

I have an original Propaganda photo that looked like the tabs not from an Oberleutnant.

You OK now? Have I explained this sufficiently for you?

[Dave Kane]

Just as a side note (and we DO need to get back to S&L crosses, including how those "dents" came to be on the 'Glunz' cross!), it is interesting that Glunz pretty obviously is not wearing an official set of the oakleaves in later photos. So, "commercial" sets were still out there and available (at least to those "entitled") following the ban on commercial sales in 1941. Glunz got his in 1944, just as Hartmann was able to buy, commercially, a cross, in that same year.

Leroy, that's a lot of assumptions in only 3 sentences

Here's an interesting Cross......and, no words other than my opener!

[Leroy]

A VERY late cross. Magnetic core, heavily pitted and rusted ,and repainted, with rust coming back through. Full 6-9 flaw on both sides. Beading flaws on 3, 6 and 9 o'clock arms. No silver mark. "Average " dent row. Lacquer, but only some kind of "sparkly" silver frosting (rhodium?). No "dimples" on 3 o'clock arm (and, although I can't get a good photo, that area is remarkably intact and looks pristine).

[Dietrich Maerz]

Dave,

my age is showing: I can't make out the stamp? What is it?

[Brian S]

Here is Glunz's "official" photo following award of the Oakleaves. Because these photos were usually taken immediately following the ceremony, it is probably safe to believe this is the "awarded set" of Oakleaves. The cross appears worn. I cannot tell if it is an S&L or Juncker.

Pretty sure it's a Juncker.

But again, that photo is NOT good enough to see if it's a photo with his award or the award is pasted on by the propaganda folks from an existing photo.

[Leroy]

3 o'clock arm

[Leroy]

Brian,
Not a pasted photo, but a real one following Glunz's award.

Another of the "late" cross I was showing. 6 o'clock beading flaws.

[Leroy]

Another. 9 o'clock beading flaws.

[Brian S]

Just as a side note (and we DO need to get back to S&L crosses, including how those "dents" came to be on the 'Glunz' cross!), it is interesting that Glunz pretty obviously is not wearing an official set of the oakleaves in later photos. So, "commercial" sets were still out there and available (at least to those "entitled") following the ban on commercial sales in 1941. Glunz got his in 1944, just as Hartmann was able to buy, commercially, a cross, in that same year.

Yeah, I don't know how you've come to this either...

We never left the S&L discussion Leroy, but we're not jumping to conclusions either, well you are...

That Glunz cross is very important.

You don't know if those are 'dents'.

YOu don't know where/when he got the oaks. Although the oaks probably appeared simultaneously with the RK. Which, does NOT help this cause.

[Brian S]

Brian,
Not a pasted photo, but a real one following Glunz's award.

Another of the "late" cross I was showing. 6 o'clock beading flaws.

How do you know this?

[Leroy]

Bob,
I, too, would love a "worn" set, whether or not it was the "official" one.
Best,
Leroy

[Brian S]

Here is Glunz's "official" photo following award of the Oakleaves. Because these photos were usually taken immediately following the ceremony, it is probably safe to believe this is the "awarded set" of Oakleaves. The cross appears worn. I cannot tell if it is an S&L or Juncker.

You jump to so many conclusions Leroy...

I have over a hundred propaganda photos and I'm guessing 20% plus of them are photos with photo cropped crosses, Luftaffe tabs updated on old photos with paint, etc.

[Brian S]

As always, this is so unfocused...

I only hope Dietrich sits back and watches and maybe a new photo will appear. That's why I brought up the Glunz cross here.

But getting to the facts is amazingly difficult with so many conclusions Leroy...

[Leroy]

Leroy, that's a lot of assumptions in only 3 sentences

Well, the photos of Glunz with Oakleaves would have to be 1944 and later, he certainly wasn't wearing Oakleaves before they were awarded, the set in the B&W photos does not match (from what I can see) any "official type" and, lastly, Dietrich told us about Hartmann buying a cross in 1944 and I am making the assumption that his statement is true!

Regards,
Leroy


P.S. Brian, the color photo is the standard "post-award" pose, with Glunz very neatly dressed. Color film, as I UNDERSTAND it, was not normally available to private photographers late in the war. But, I may be wrong and perhaps others will say if I am. So, I'll be quiet.

[Dietrich Maerz]

"Average " dent row.

Sorry, but what is an "average" dent row? Average for post-war? Average for pre-1957? Average good or average bad?

Dietrich