Is this an original EK1

[grueni1208]

IMO an original Deschler EK I with unusual hinge and pin system.
At the moment I know two hinge and pin systems by Deschler, but I think it's good possible that Deschler used another systems (early wartime), too. Other maker's used differents systems, too. This distinctive hinge and pin system was used by another maker's, too.

IMO it's a rare Deschler version which is unfortunately denazified.

Regards

Grueni

[DaveNZ]

interesting comment grueni: thanks for your input once again

well i guess the jury is still out on this piece.

it does make sense that it could be an early cross as the centre is brass

[DaveNZ]

hope im not flogging a dead horse...but

I was reading that all 1939 EK1's are 44mm by 44mm on the edges of the cross.

this ek1 in question is slightly larger than 44x44; being more like 45mm x 45mm (can you believe I dont own a ruler!)

anyhow; when compared to all my other ek1's it is consistantly larger by at least 1mm

surely this is a nail in its coffin and makes it a fake?

[grueni1208]

I was reading that all 1939 EK1's are 44mm by 44mm on the edges of the cross.

...like the EK II's

- Uebergroesse EK II (47 x 47)
- EK II's by maker 24 (45 x 45)
- EK II's by maker 75 (45 x 45)
- Schinkel EK II's (43 x 43)


I would say the "44 x 44" is only a standard value

- my EK I "3" : 43,69 x 43,81
- my EK I "L54" : 44,31 x 44,28
- my EK I "26" : 44,50 x 44,50

Regards

Grueni

[DaveNZ]

thanks grueni

oh well i can live with uncertainty

[LuckyLuudje]

I just saw this thread and I completely agree with Gruenie!
It's IMO one of the earliest and rarest Deschler variants.

I have exactly the same Deschler with exactly the same NON Magnetic core and same setup.
But mine still has it swass .
This Deschler has many differences with a "regular" Deschler

You don't have to live in uncertainty Dave!
Sadly it is denazified, but to me you have one of the most interesting Deschler variants.

[streptile]

I would say it could be an early Deschler EK I with non-magnetic core and a pin and hing system which is unusual for Deschler.

I agree, but I'm not sure if it's early, or late. I know this thread is old, so perhaps Daniel has some more thoughts. But overall I call this a good and uncommon Deschler.

[DaveNZ]

I agree, but I'm not sure if it's early, or late. I know this thread is old, so perhaps Daniel has some more thoughts. But overall I call this a good and uncommon Deschler.

thanks

yes I would be interested in hearing what others think now some time has passed.

i still have this cross down as a fake until proven otherwise

[WEISNER]

You can pretty well strike it from the fake list Dave IMO! I also wonder if Grueni (Daniel) has any new thoughts?
Kevin

[fabri-online]

In my opinion it 's not fake but it 's not a contemporary cross.
I think that there too many different things, all together in just one cross, to let me think it 's a good variante. Then I don't see the typical contemporary Deschler quality.
All let me think that is a postwar production by Deschler, maybe using some wartime parts, it 's not so clear in these pics to me.
Reasons of my thought :

1 - it 's not massive
2 - non magnetic core
3 - anchor and pin just with a contemporary form but too little/slim
4 - back plate profile was not blunt
5 - date don't seems to match perfectly

[fabri-online]

It seems to me the brother of that other one showed by Matthiew , mod. '57 , also date seems to match.

[LuckyLuudje]

Bringing up an old thread is mostly done by a reason, so if there are new discoveries please let us not stay in the dark.

After Daniel showed a 1957 EK1 on a German Forum wich seem very comparable this Deschler cross made me review the cross and thought a lot about it and I still don't know the answer.
I do know that I have a similar Deschler with core that looks to be made of silverplated brass and it came with good provenance.
But I know that it doesn't make it wartime. I recently bought a RK group from my friend who got it directly from the family after the recipient died, but it also contained a postwar Souval RK. So who knows what happend in the time after the war till now.

Many wartime parts on this EK1 have also been used on presumed Deschler 1957 EK's, but it doesn't mean that this cross is postwar manufactured.
Many of the early EK's are made of wartime parts or parts made by wartime dies and these are often stamped by wartime stamps.
It would be very interesting if this cross is postwar made (wich I still don't think).
If it turns out that the comparable 1957 EK's are indeed made by Deschler it would raise many questions.
Did they use leftover parts from the early part of the war or did they use the worn out die postwar for the frames of the 1939 EK's as well as the 1957 EK's.
This could mean that Deschler did make Postwar copies, something I have not yet heard off.

I hope that someone will find the answers one day about who made this cross and when.

[fabri-online]

In my opinion it 's not fake but it 's not a contemporary cross.
I think that there too many different things, all together in just one cross, to let me think it 's a good variante. Then I don't see the typical contemporary Deschler quality.
All let me think that is a postwar production by Deschler, maybe using some wartime parts, it 's not so clear in these pics to me.
Reasons of my thought :

1 - it 's not massive
2 - non magnetic core
3 - anchor and pin just with a contemporary form but too little/slim
4 - back plate profile was not blunt
5 - date don't seems to match perfectly

I need to edit my point # 4 : pic in post # 2 shows a blunt profile of the back plate, I think this part could be contemporary.

Luud, if possible can you take some pics of your i? thanks in advance

[DaveNZ]

so i guess my cross is fake after all?

its no big deal really; im just happy to have survived the earthquake here with no major damage

[fabri-online]

its no big deal really; im just happy to have survived the earthquake here with no major damage

This is the most important thing of course

so i guess my cross is fake after all?

It 's not fake, IMO just a postwar product with some wartime parts from a wartime manufacturer.