Knights crosses are not rare, they are easliy available today. It would have been very easy for a RKtrager to pick up and original RK postwar to replace his confiscated awarded piece. I also think, for the price, this group is/was very desirable.
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Is the group really desirable? The RK is bought postwar and the other items are not from Mooyman as I heard. It's just a mixed bag of items which are nice in themselves but 10.000 euro's.
What do you think?Comment
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Worn wartime KC
I could never really understand the desire to own an unused cross, forgive me but an unawarded piece is a piece of jewellry.Surely the point here is ,this was not a worn wartime piece.When I saw the KC for sale it struck me that if the cross was the original wartime piece you could have added another 7 thousand euros, this guy was the first non german recipient, 19 years old, and a corporal/sergeant at that...a tank destroyer to boot in Russia !!! In a sense this would have been a unique piece of history.Comment
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So from reading this thread, as a prospective RK owner, am I now to assume that Juncker L12 RKs may be post-war?
I agree with Kyle too, an unworn/unissued RK - wartime or not - is about as valuable to me as a '57 piece, ie not at all.Comment
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A Juncker L/12 KC is NOT POSTWAR at all.Originally posted by Seigfried View Post
I think it would be wise that if you are willing to buy a KC in the future to just order the KC book from Dietrich.
If an unissued Rk is as valuable to you as a '57 piece you can always sell them to me for the same price a'57 piece is going.
To me this statement is complete nonsense.
ThanksComment
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Maybe I misunderstood Ben's and Kyle's reference to RKT buying post-war replacement L/12 crosses - I assumed they meant post-war manufacture. It is these to which I attach little value - not a wartime unissued piece (as I said earlier), if you understand me.Originally posted by Kevin V. View PostA Juncker L/12 KC is NOT POSTWAR at all.
I think it would be wise that if you are willing to buy a KC in the future to just order the KC book from Dietrich.
If an unissued Rk is as valuable to you as a '57 piece you can always sell them to me for the same price a'57 piece is going.
To me this statement is complete nonsense.
ThanksComment
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Hello,
- Buy the item not the story.
&
- Knowledge is power.
It is very simple: these things just sell better with a story, I have seen it before and I'll see it again and again and again .....
Aslong as collectors are going to believe the stories dealers and collectors tell them to sexy up a piece they are willing to buy this is going to standard practic.
This is used car dealer talk like:
- This car was of a very old lady who only used to drive to the local shop with it.
Would you believe that without evidence?
...
Or would you testdrive the car and perhaps take it to an expert?
We are talking about the same amount of money.
German bravery awards aren't like their British counterparts officially engraved, so it is always going to be difficult to put a face and/or a story to a German award.
But the British medals weren't worn in combat only the ribbon.
You just can't have everything in live
Cheers,
PeterComment
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mooyman
i posted in the old tread about this knightcross i think its is a cross from the war the groop is a good deal because the nederland cuffband is oke and very rear the brief with it is very strange because i have a copy thats very different
and have his name under itif someone will posted it i mail it to him
regards from holland pietComment
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For Scheveningen:
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In the case that it doesn't belong to Mooyman and some of the members probably think so, I don't think it is a good buy at all, even if all items are originals and not reproductions. If you pay 10.000,- euro for these items and you are guaranteed by a dealer, of whom you may expect that he has a certain knowledge of medals, that they belonged to Mooyman, and afterwards it turns out that they are not, you are deceived. In particular a professional dealer has to know what he sells. I suppose the buyer made his decision to purchase the RK by the fact that it was sold as the one of Mooyman and not because he wanted to buy a bunch of some original items (let's pretend that the RK is original), even if the price would have been okay. I must say that I have been very positive on Niemann so far. All items that I purchased from him were original and the prices are less than average.Comment
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No pretence needed, the RK is 100% original wartime........Comment
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Bought
Harry nobody here is contesting the L/12, however the piece was bought, and I stressed bought in Germany following his release from a Dutch jail.
You may as well go and buy a ring, it has no value in the sense of an awarded medal.Comment
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Awarded or not it is still a nice cross.Originally posted by Kyle Harrington View Post
How can you be absolutely sure that the medals you have in your collection are actually awarded even when speaking of a woundbadge, EKII, EKI etc.
Thanks
KevinComment
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I was fortunate to visit Detlev Niemann as he sold the Mooymann Knight´s cross the first time. It was already sold but not shipped (obviously!). It was a well-worn L/12, with a well-worn wartime produced ribbon. The cross had been worn under such conditions that the swastika had been slightly damaged by rust, polished and blued (instead of repainted black). If it hadn´t already been sold, I would have bought it right on the spot!
The very same cross was recently sold by Detlev Niemann again.
Just to sort things out.
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