Spanish Cross in sliver with swords

[jacques]

page 2 of the article.

[Bob Hritz]

To each his own, but I would not have one in my collection. The eagles are crude looking and the overall fit and finish is not pleasing to me. The pin, hinge and catch are of the cheapest manufacture.

With the Spanish Cross being a common badge, there are pleanty of much finer examples available. I suppost the specialist, who would like an example of every maker, may want it.

Bob Hritz

[Frank Heukemes]

Dear Bob,

Sure, if getting the most beautiful Spanish Cross is the aim, this one is not it. But the reason for not wanting to own that cross cannot possibly be that it is not original. That is what we wanted to show.

[Richard]

Could this be private manufacture as a period replacment? I can't believe that something this crude would be manufactured at the same time as the much finer detailed crosses at the time that had much better pin hardware.

There do seem to be slight differences between Frank's cross and this one, most notably the pin appears to be different on both. Marcus' seems to differ in that the pin on his is much longer and flatter. The catch and hinge are also almost to the edge of the arms on his cross and are inset to a much greater degree on the one pictured by Jaques and Frank. The one that Jaques shows without swords is closer to the cross that started this thread but it appears the catch on that one may have been resoldered at some time in the past. The hinge and catch assemblies on Franks also seem to be of better quality whereas on the cross in question, they are very crude.

The eagles seem very high, almost on top of the sword hilts. This characteristic used to be a diagnostic of sorts to distinguish a fake from a genuine example. Frank, the thread to which you provided a link mentioned that you also received or were expecting to receive photographs of the original recipient. Did any show him wearing the cross you pictured? That would help to authenticate this version.

Something else that occured to me. Could this be a Spanish manufactured version of the cross? It seems that Spanish made examples of third Reich awards were much more crude. But then I can't think of why Spain would want to make this award since this would never have been awarded to Spaniards unlike the KVK.
Richard V

[MH184]

Hey Mark,



Sorry I didn't respond sooner to your request, here are some pic's of which may give you an idea (uumm sort of) but are no means really any good to man nor beast. I'll delete these tomorrow and replace them with some daylight quality pictures.


Kr

Marcus

[MH184]

Close up for Mark



The eagles are joined via the wing tips to the arms, on one the eagles there almost seems evidence of the wings at one time perhaps being joined to the hilt of the sword ? I can't see any visible sign of attachment to the sword blade on either four eagles.

The two eagles just below the hilt are more seperated from the blade than the other lower down eagles towards the blade tip.

I'll try my best to take better pic's tomorrow, and from angles and views for you.

[mmiller]

Marcus,

I've been jumping in and out of this thread between home repairs, auto maintenance, spending time with the significant other, and so on and so forth. I appreciate the close ups. And yes, they are! Any chance you can shoot a couple 'frames' straight on from the front. I'm just looking for details in the sword handle, the eagle, and the eagle attachment to the cross.

I'm not disputing that the hinge style, similar to the one on your Cross, was never period made. I'm not disputing that the catch style, similar to the one on your Cross, was never period made. I'm not disputing that the badge in Niemann's Catalog is not period made. I'm not disputing that the EK linked to a different thread was not period made. I'm not disputing that the badge, in the article presented by Jacques, was not period made.

I guess Bob Hritz and I feel the same way about your badge. The quality is visually less than all the other Spanish Crosses presented, in this thread. That bothers me. We can go back and forth all night. My point here is that all good fakes are modelled after an authentic period-styled badge.

Can anyone post a Spanish Cross with the long narrow pin, such as the one found on Marcus' badge?

Marcus, no offense meant. I always hope that all badges turn out to be authentic. Yours is no exception!

Regards,
Mark

[MH184]

I'm not experienced on these to say about the quality as such, but I do know comparing to several others....it lacks any appeal as such, but overall I'd agree, it's not pretty is it and it does lack what you'd certainly expect (it in fact is bloody ugly for a beautiful design....it looks like what you'd expect a budget award to be like )


Here we go, I hope these are a little better

[MH184]

handle 1

[MH184]

Handle 2

[MH184]

another

[MH184]

I'm not very good at this close up stuff..it's very hit and miss


They look more like fat hawks than eagles don't they

[mmiller]

Hi Marcus,

Thanks for the additional close-ups of the 'buzzards', , per my request. The close ups show me what I thought I wouldn't see. Maybe it's just my eyes, but I can't see the telltale signs of the 'solder blobs', that I would expect to see. [Marcus, I hate to ask for yet another image, but how about a close-up where the eagle's wing tips meet the arms?] In other words....... solder or no solder. I was under the impression that all Spanish Cross' had the eagles attached 'after the fact' , and the means of attachment was solder. Is there an exception to the rule ? I can't believe that the solder job on this otherwise crude example, was superior to what was done on a CEJ, or a PM. That is impossible to accept .

It's almost 0900 Eastern time. Time for a breakfast hefeweizen

Regards,
Mark (U.S.)

[MH184]

Hey Mark,



No problem at all my friend.

Strange isn't this interent thingy, I just had my lunch and it's just gone three in the afternoon....it still amazes me I can chat away about medals to someone thousands of miles away.

So I'm looking for any sign of solder........

[MH184]

Just visible