Announcement

**Frank Heukemes** · 08-22-2006, 02:47 AM

Hi Vladimir,

My opinion also has not changed, but I would love to hold this shield and look at it closer to gain more knowledge about it.

**Pascal H.** · 08-22-2006, 05:54 AM

Originally posted by Stijn David

Hi,

Both shields are fake => i was referring towards the originally posted one.

How can you be so certain that the first shield is a fake?

KR
Pascal

**KBH** · 08-22-2006, 07:16 AM

Originally posted by Frank Heukemes

Hi Vladimir,

My opinion also has not changed, but I would love to hold this shield and look at it closer to gain more knowledge about it.

Hi Frank,

I don't know much about this Cholm. Just know that it was found 3 years ago and nowdays it is held at the one private collection in Russia. Sorry

**polux** · 08-22-2006, 09:13 AM

Cholm

Hello to all,
I followed with attention the evolution of this article.

For several years, I am an attentive observer of this excellent forum set up by Mr Bianchi. Thanks to this forum, I was able to bind numerous contacts with persons who share the same centre of interest that me.

For me, the main purpose of this forum is to enrich my knowledge by the contribution of information passed on by persons who have a different particular knowledge of mine. These persons agree to put their knowledge in the services of the other less informed collectors. From my part, I always put to others in disposal of the images of documents of my collection, collected information during researches, etc... (some members will recognize here, Stijn ;-)), etc...).

In the case which occupies us, I note ideas expressed by each, but I find damage that the assertions advanced by someone are not developed. I am anxious once more to indicate it : the purpose of this forum is to make advance the knowledge of our common hobby. Let us not to forget. We are a small group of persons which let us share the same interest for a dark period of our history. Are gentlemen and take advantage to others of our knowledge. I well understand the Gene's and Stijn's position. They do not wish that their information fall in of bad hands. This site contains a association area for the members. Why not open an article on this subject in this protected space ? We could all to take so advantage of your knowledge. I am still anxious to repeat it, we a member of a "club". Are gentlemen. For several years, I was always surprised of the quality of my contacts on this forum. It is not necessary to forget that the very great majority of the members of this very particular "club" is excellently sympathetic and intelligent persons.

I stay in your listening and present you my best greetings.

Polux

PS: as Vladimir : saddened but I always have difficulties to express myself correctly in the Shakespeare's language.

**KBH** · 08-22-2006, 09:21 AM

2 polux

E X A C T L Y !

Besr regards,
Vladimir

**Pascal H.** · 08-23-2006, 02:15 AM

As it suddenly became very silent I thought to bump this thread up.

@ Stijn and Gene, as I understand your replies correctly then you are saying that the first Cholm shield is in fact a new type of fake hitting the streets?

KR
Pascal

**Gene** · 08-23-2006, 08:39 AM

I am saying that this piece has characteristics that at first glance look great, but when I look closer I see things that I do not like. Of course I am only going by these photos and would need to examine this up close, but from what I see I do not believe this is genuine. My deep feeling is that it is an incredible forgery.

**Pascal H.** · 08-23-2006, 08:51 AM

Gene,
Is this the first time you have seen this type of Cholm shield?

KR
Pascal

**Gene** · 08-23-2006, 11:21 AM

Isn't it obvious that I have never seen this "type" before?

**Pascal H.** · 08-23-2006, 11:58 AM

Originally posted by Gene

Isn't it obvious that I have never seen this "type" before?

I am sorry Gene if my English is not as good as yours but English is just not my first language.
I think from Stijn’s replies I can conclude that this is the first time he seen this “type” of Cholm shield but I wasn’t sure you ever seen this “type” of shield before.

BTW how many of your genuine examples were zinc shi<st1></st1>elds with 4 prongs?<o></o>

KR
Pascal

**Gene** · 08-23-2006, 12:23 PM

None of my examples were zinc with 4 prongs. Please let's not turn this into a "So, you have never owned one so how could you be sure" argument.

**Stijn David** · 08-23-2006, 01:28 PM

cholmshield

Hello,

I read with great interest the words you have put down Polux, indeed we must share in order to be able to learn.

That is exactly why i have written the article on the Cholmshield as presented on this website, that is also the reason that a publication will be launched at the end of this year, but then about the award document that accopmanyed the cholmshield and that is also the reason why SKF is in existence (see : http://www.skf-vzw.org) .

It is my feeling that the first shown shield (as originally discussed) is not a original (as said and written before). That is my feeling as made by observations while looking at these pictures, as i have not seen it in real life.

I am sorry iff someone does want more (as in order = 100 % )info on all the details of originals, but that is against my principe of collecting. I do not wisch to be the collector who is responsable though good trust and in his believe to help other collector friends for the 100 % fake. Then again i will always help you guys out as i have done before iff asked questions about certain pieces.

Cordial greetings and thanks for making this interesting thread

**Stive** · 08-23-2006, 01:54 PM

Hello to all!
Sorry for disturbing such interesting discussion.
I'd like to add, that such type of Cholm shields as first KVN's Cholm has never been found in Russia during excavations or in military museums.

**ardennes1944** · 08-23-2006, 02:04 PM

hello,
here mine for example
models out of zinc with three hooks.

phil

**ardennes1944** · 08-23-2006, 02:13 PM

the reverse

phil.

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Cholm - original or fake?

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