Warning: session_start(): open(/var/cpanel/php/sessions/ea-php74/sess_83902e54dcd47ffc54634c56b38d8677f27bc16974d9282a, O_RDWR) failed: No space left on device (28) in /home/devwehrmacht/public_html/forums/includes/vb5/frontend/controller/page.php on line 71 Warning: session_start(): Failed to read session data: files (path: /var/cpanel/php/sessions/ea-php74) in /home/devwehrmacht/public_html/forums/includes/vb5/frontend/controller/page.php on line 71 Tojo Flag Alert ! - Wehrmacht-Awards.com Militaria Forums
EpicArtifacts

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Tojo Flag Alert !

Collapse
X
Collapse
 
  • Page of 2
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
Previous 1 2 template Next
    #1

    Tojo Flag Alert !

    Hi All,

    Would like to give a heads up on this piece.

    I was browsing through this site and stumbled upon this Tojo Flag.

    http://www.flyingtigerantiques.com/m...gory_Code=10JM





    Here are the descriptions:

    "SUBJECT: This is a small Japanese hanging flag with kanji, or characters. The characters may have been added around the red sun against a white field as a good luck wish or patriotic message, or for another reason.

    VINTAGE: Circa World War II.

    SIZE: Approximately 25-3/4” in height and 16” in width (not including foam board); ties are about 2-1/2” each.

    CONSTRUCTION/MATERIALS: Silk or muslin with inked details.

    ATTACHMENT: Ties.

    MARKINGS: None.

    ITEM NOTES: This flag is shrink-wrapped and pinned to a piece of foam board. It will be shipped unwrapped and folded without the foam board, unless arrangements are made for pick-up or special shipping to preserve the shrink wrap mounting. This is from a Japanese collection which we will be listing more of over the next few months. VGEX09 LBIEX8/11

    CONDITION: 8 (Excellent-): The flag has been well-preserved with very light wear.

    GUARANTEE: As with all my items, this piece is guaranteed original."

    Regards,
    Taka
    Last edited by J7W22007; 11-26-2013, 03:49 AM.
    Tags: None
    #2
    They also have an IJN towel described as NLF hachimaki.

    Comment

      #3
      Originally posted by Staldion View Post
      They also have an IJN towel described as NLF hachimaki.
      I saw that as well.

      Regards,
      Taka

      Comment

        #4
        "Tojo flags" are indeed WWII era, they just aren't real Japanese yosegaki. They fool so many people because they have real age to them, and often come directly from vets or their estates.

        I'd buy one for what it is if it was cheap enough. Any serious yosegaki collector should have a Tojo and a Seabee flag as examples of WWII era fakes. But $295 is pushing it for a real yosegaki unless it has something special about it (Tiger painting, famous signature, etc).

        Comment

          #5
          Originally posted by Staldion View Post
          They also have an IJN towel described as NLF hachimaki.
          To be fair, I'm sure many sailors used them as hachimaki.

          Comment

            #6
            Originally posted by Papa Nambu View Post
            To be fair, I'm sure many sailors used them as hachimaki.
            I agree, to be fair, I think it should be selling this way.

            Comment

              #7
              Here's what Tojo's actual signature looks like:

              Tojo Hideki


              古人今人若流水
              東條英機

              "Our ancestors and we as streams."
              Tojo Hideki

              This is from the Chinese poet Li Bai's poem, "Toast to the Moon"
              [quote]把 酒 问 月
              作 者 : 李 白

              青 天 有 月 来 几 时 ， 我 今 停 杯 一 问 之 。
              人 攀 明 月 不 可 得 ， 月 行 却 与 人 相 随 。
              皎 如 飞 镜 临 丹 阙 ， 绿 烟 灭 尽 清 辉 发 。
              但 见 宵 从 海 上 来 ， 宁 知 晓 向 云 间 没 。
              白 兔 捣 药 秋 复 春 ， 嫦 娥 孤 栖 与 谁 邻 。
              今 人 不 见 古 时 月 ， 今 月 曾 经 照 古 人 。
              古 人 今 人 若 流 水 ， 共 看 明 月 皆 如 此 。
              唯 愿 当 歌 对 酒 时 ， 月 光 常 照 金 樽 里 。

              Li Bai: Toast to the Moon
              Li Bai of Tang Dynasty
              Translated by Laijon Liu 20090301

              When the moon shall be bright?
              Let me hold up my cup to ponder.
              Human can never pluck the moon,
              But she always goes with our step.
              Shines as a mirror over red palace,
              And thru the green mist she glitters.
              The night wraps around from sea,
              And dawn disappears into clouds.
              White rabbit grinds in all seasons, (1)
              And goddess lives without a friend.
              This moon is not of ancient times,
              But it once shone upon ancestors.
              Our ancestors and we as streams,
              And together we looked up to her.
              I can only sing and pour my wine,
              And wish she often shines into my cup.

              source
              secondary source in Japanese
              Li Bai's poem

              --Guy

              Comment

                #8
                Very interesting info, Guy-san.

                Thank you for sharing.

                Cheers!
                Taka

                Comment

                  #9
                  Tojo Flag

                  b
                  Attached Files

                  Comment

                    #10
                    Tojo Flag

                    Can anyone tell the purpose and use for these Tojo flags, I know they have some thing to do with the SeaBee's and are WWII period, but really do not understand their use.

                    thanks,
                    Jack Neeley
                    Attached Files

                    Comment

                      #11
                      Originally posted by dolchmann07 View Post
                      Can anyone tell the purpose and use for these Tojo flags, I know they have some thing to do with the SeaBee's and are WWII period, but really do not understand their use.

                      thanks,
                      Jack Neeley
                      They were made to sell to unsuspecting rear-echelon troops who didn't make it to the battlefield -- they rightly wanted to bring back a souvenir for their children/family/etc. I'm certain the GIs who obtained them (via poker or direct sale) were not aware they were fakes.

                      --Guy

                      P.S., Hmmmm..... then again, there was that Stars & Stripes photo of a SeaBee workshop making Japanese signature flags!

                      Comment

                        #12
                        I have seen more and more of these flags coming up for sale on fleabay lately. They must have had an assembly line going on with these flags LOL.

                        Comment

                          #13
                          I've collected around 15 pics of "Tojo" flags that are or were recently for sale on the web, many of those on the auction site.

                          They're easy to spot. Usually vertical in orientation, which is not the natural way to regard your national flag. The "meatball" is often oversized in proportion. Many have two identical red ink "temple stamps" and the black ink writing looks laughable with any familiarity with written Japanese (something I've been acquiring since joining this forum).

                          Of those on e-buy most are 'buy it now' for the price of a genuine Hinomaru no Yosegaki. I think many of the sellers are at least aware there is a problem with their item and fishing for the greater fool. Often the description says "fresh from a veteran's estate" which for me has become a euphemism for run the other way.

                          Regards, Rod

                          Comment

                            #14
                            Originally posted by dolchmann07 View Post
                            Can anyone tell the purpose and use for these Tojo flags, I know they have some thing to do with the SeaBee's and are WWII period, but really do not understand their use.

                            thanks,
                            Jack Neeley
                            I'm still trying to find that photo of a Seabee flag-making operation -- I saw it here on WAF somewhere, but can't find it here or on Google Image.

                            However, I did find a great second-hand quote from WAFer RonC who, in August 2007, writes:

                            I picked this [rayed-sun flag] up a great number of years ago from a vet. I got it home and showed it to my father. He started laughing. He asked where I got it, and then said that I had not acquired a real Japanese flag! Then he told me the story. Dad was a Seabee in WW2, and those who know Seabees know they are "improvisers". Dad said this was without a doubt a Seabee made Japanese flag, they lived on the land in the Pacific with the Marines. Dad said they got hold of parachute silk; took it to their shop on Guam and etc.; cut it into flag size pieces; made a stencil; laid out the pieces on the workbench area; mixed up a solution of red "dye" using highly thinned red paint with some other stuff in it as well, placed the stencil and sprayed "Japanese" flags. They then took these to the regular Navy guys who would come into the dock areas from time to time (and never really got off to get souveniers) and traded the flags to them for fresh fruit and ice cream. They then took part of that to the Marines, who they also got along with very well, and gave it to them. Out of gratitude, the Marines would give the Seabees Japanese helmets, rifles, and other things......which they would again take to the regular Navy guys and deal to them for more goodies etc.........which they again would share with the Marines.......making a continuing circle of commerce. My father could not of course tell for sure if it was one he had helped make, but he said it was exactly like them and he was absolutely certain of what it was. Instead of being upset by what he told me, it has had a special place in my stuff since that time, and I will never forget the kick my father got when he first saw it. He of course is gone now, but every time I see it I remember him and the smile when he saw it. He did say however that it wasn't as good as the ones his guys had done, because this one had the red "dye" smeared in a few places.

                            Source
                            --Guy

                            Comment

                              #15
                              Here's the photo
                              Attached Files

                              Comment

                              Previous 1 2 template Next

                              Users Viewing this Thread

                              Collapse

                              There is currently 1 user online. 0 members and 1 guests.

                              Most users ever online was 10,032 at 08:13 PM on 09-28-2024.

                              Working...
                              X