The Surprising "Wideframe" EK Family

[streptile]

Fantastic thread...Excellent Research Trevor!

Thank you very much, Steve.

[fabri-online]

Hi Trevor
apologize for my great delay, I find this work very very intesting !!
I have had some problems to understand all because my English is not so good and I have lost time.
Really very interesting to find these crosses dated 1870 1914 and 1939 with the same frame design.
One question was born inside me during the reading : when were manufactured ? I have read your answers about it, could be right but my question for you is : these frames seems manufactured using the same material but if the 1914 and 1870 were manufactured in the 1st 15 years of the twentieth century why they are not in silver ? didn' t the EKII manufactured normally in silver in that era ? I find a little bit strange that Juncker or AWS used other material less noble than silver. Just answers I have based on my experience, please forgive me if may be they have a simple answer.

[streptile]

Hi Fabrizio,

Nice to have your comments here, thank you.

I think Greg M probably answered your questions best upthread when he wrote:

Another interesting tidbit----
It is widely known that AWS made a lot of crosses with frames made
of materials other than silver. (The brass pillowbacks as example)
My 1870 wideframe has a yellow alloy frame of some sort. Not sure
what it is but it is NOT silver.

AWS is one of a few firms (of which I am personally aware) that offered a few
material options for their decorations. A replacement EK could be bought, for example,
in an alloy construction or, for a small increase in price, in real silver ("echt silber").
These options may be seen in period catalogues. I see no reason why Juncker could
not have done the same.

Indeed, the 1870 and 1914 EKs are known to exist in different materials. Some
are silver, some are alloy. Greg M has an alloy 1870 Wideframe, as he says,
and Tiger1 has a silver one:


WAF member Tiger 1

Here is a 1914 Wideframe in silver next to another in alloy:


WAF member Roglebk

Furthermore, my assignation of Juncker as the maker of the 1870 and 1914 is
really speculative. While I personally believe it to be true, there is less evidence
to support it than there is evidence to support the assertion that they made the
1939-series crosses. So I call these Junckers, but AWS is another possibility, as
are any number of other makers.

By the way, if anyone has a Juncker catalogue, I would be very happy to see it
posted, even without photos, to know if Juncker, too, sold EKs made from different
materials.

[gregM]

Here is my 1870 "wideframe".
You can see it has a yellowish cast to it under the patina. It is not
brass as it will not polish up like brass or silver does. My best guess is
some form of Neusilber.

[fabri-online]

Hi guys
I didn' t know some manufacturers used that materials for their frames..
thank you very much for your answers, very good explanation and pics helped me to clarify more of course. You 're letting me with a desire to have one..

[Christopher]

Great work.

Great job Trevor,
Sorry for not replying sooner, but I have been on leave for quite some time from the forum, but, I love your presentation and am compelled to congradulate you on your findings. Very,, well done!
Christopher

[Tony & Kaiser]

Trevor. Wow. What a great job you did. Way to go. Tony

[streptile]

Thank you, Christopher and Tony.

Tony, I've spent hours looking through your website, so it's nice to hear from you here .

[streptile]

I'll add this one to this thread.







Discussed further HERE.

[Wik]

Trevor, that is one fine looking cross.

The core details are so crisp and nice. Absolute beauty.

[gregM]

Awesome job with the photography.

[streptile]

Awesome job with the photography.

Thanks, Greg.

[streptile]

Since I am parting with them, I'll add these crosses to this thread.

They were two of the ones I used for reference and research, and are by far the finest two examples of the Juncker Schinkel I have seen:

Number 1





Number 2

[gregM]

That #1 cross is a real good looker.

[streptile]

That #1 cross is a real good looker.

Thanks, Greg. They're both just real beauties.