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**Biro** · 05-26-2009, 07:14 AM

Originally posted by saschaw View Post

...The cores were cast in the Berlin Eisengießerei, and then were distributed to several (and there not named!) Berlin jewelers. As they were not made by Wagner" we are not talking anymore of a "Wagner core" but call it "Type A". ...

A very good and important point. There are 'Type A' cores that we generally associate with Wagner that are clearly and correctly marked by Godet... proving that Godet sourced more than one core for their product. HERE is an example..

The 'short 7' may well have been Godets attempt at manufacturing there own core as the 'short 7's' are only ever seen unmarked, or correctly marked Godet - never Wagner.

Marshall

**Brian S** · 05-26-2009, 08:57 AM

Originally posted by saschaw View Post

Well, it's like this, according to a book published back into the 1870s by Louis Schneider...

The cores were cast in the Berlin Eisengießerei, and then were distributed to several (and there not named!) Berlin jewelers. We can guess some names, but he does not give any. Wagner and Godet for sure, but more than 40,000 crosses is a bit much for two and it were presumably some more that framed the cores. He does not say clearly but we can be sure that the cores of the first series had all the same design, with some minor(!) differences. As they were not made by Wagner" we (or I) are not talking anymore of a "Wagner core" but call it "Type A". As the frames were made by different jewelers, I think some had the hump and some didn't. I don't see a reason for a necessary time difference in this. No proofs for it, but it as close as we can guess from period sources.

That's great data!!!

And with this, yes the hump is irrelevant to anything other than another framer.

**streptile** · 05-26-2009, 09:11 AM

Originally posted by saschaw View Post

Well, it's like this, according to a book published back into the 1870s by Louis Schneider...The cores were cast in the Berlin Eisengießerei, and then were distributed to several (and there not named!) Berlin jewelers. We can guess some names, but he does not give any. Wagner and Godet for sure, but more than 40,000 crosses is a bit much for two and it were presumably some more that framed the cores. He does not say clearly but we can be sure that the cores of the first series had all the same design, with some minor(!) differences. As they were not made by Wagner" we (or I) are not talking anymore of a "Wagner core" but call it "Type A". As the frames were made by different jewelers, I think some had the hump and some didn't. I don't see a reason for a necessary time difference in this. No proofs for it, but it as close as we can guess from period sources.

This is superb information to know, thank you!

**streptile** · 05-29-2009, 12:00 PM

In light of recent information, I think we should start a thread in which we post and compare high-resolution photos of Type A-core 1870 EK2 frames -- both with each other and with marked EK1s -- to try and see who made what.

I will photograph mine this coming weekend and start one, unless someone can do it first.

My bet is that we can figure out which is a Wagner, at least.

~Trevor

**gregM** · 05-29-2009, 01:31 PM

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1870 EK2 with "25" eichenlaub

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