Early ZB and THW items

[hoover]

Hi Steve,

now I have some time to write some more infos.

Thge woolen tunic is the "Kälteschutzanzug", a "cold weather suit". It was introduced in 1962 as a winter suit, but is was not very popular because its wool. The nickname was "Pferdedecke" (horse blanket).

The West German Katastrophenschutz was divided in 4 large parts:
1. BLSV (Bundesluftschutzverband, Federal Air Protection Assosiation)
2. LSHD (Luftschutzhilfsdienst, Air Protection Helping Service)
3. THW (Technisches Hilfswerk, technical Helping Service)
4. Fachorganisationen (Special Brands of Organisations), like DRK (German Red Cross), Samariter, Johanniter, Malteser, ASB (all medical services).

The BLSV´s task was the education of the civilians about air protection, building shelters and to run the big air raid shelters in the cities.
In war the BLSV had to run the shelters and to support the LSHD.

The LSHD was divided into 8 Branches (Fachdienste). Every Branch had his own piping/collar patches)
1. Brandschutzdienst (fire service) red
2. Bergungsdienst (recovery service) black
3. Sanitätsdienst (medical service) blue
4. Veterinärdienst (animals medical service) pink
5. ABC-Dienst brown
6. Betreuungsdienst (psychological assistance) green
7. Lenkungs- und Sozialdienst (social assistance and organisation) orange
8. Fernmeldedienst (signal service) yellow


Here are the collar patches of the branches.

In the beginning there were piping around the collar and collar patches.
From mid-60´s on the new tunics only got the collar patches, but my father had a tunic only with piping without collart patches. It seems there were a lot of non regulation items then.

The patches on the left arm were first "ZB" for "Ziviler Bevölkerungsschutz". From 25. January 1966 it was changed to "ZS" for "Zivilschutz".

Some of the West German "Bundesbetriebe" (Federal companies) had their own catastrophy protection services, like the Bundesbahn (Federal Railway) or the Bundespost (Federal Postal Service).

Until 1964 the BLSV wore dark blue uniforms, the LSHD khakigrau and the THW and most of the other medical services grey uniforms. From 1964 on the LSHD got the same grey uniforms like the THW. Only the BLSV stayed with their dark blues.


Here is my BLSV-guy.
The armpatch is BLSV. All itenms are BLSV-stamped, too: Helmet, goggles, gas mask bag, breadbag and the water bottle with dark blue cover. A rarity is the dark blue web belt, the later ones were the standard black leather ones.

Maybe I can find the time to take some pics of my collection.

Bye
Frank

[Collectinsteve]

Wow! Frank, I learned more from you about ZB/ZS uniforms than everything I previously knew put together. Thanks very much for that!

What pieces am I missing for my 1963 uniform? I can see the the belt is one. I expect I won't easily find one of those! I have the black "double fang" belt marked ZB, so I guess that is OK. I have the goggles and until today I did not know they were ZB related.

What is the pouch on the right of your mannequin? Is that the breadbag?

Today I purchased what appears to be near brand-new condition ZB canteens in both blue and khaki. The seller thought they might be BW TruVsu, but of course we know differently

Steve

[Gordon Craig]

Frank,

Great stuff! Nice fotos and the mannequin is impressive. Looking forward to the pictures of your collection.

Regards,

Gordon

[uscob]

Your Helmet misses the male buckle part on the plastic strap.
Here I have maybe 1 or 2 complete ones left and 200 of the earlier web Straps.
The blue grey Breadbag with the Plastic rim cover is a THW one. Some Years ago I got them directly from Storage, also new boxed Canteens and Mess tins.
For a movie on the Hamburg Flooding I sold a truckload of the old charcoal coloured Felt winter Uniforms, maybe also 2 or 3 left.
Do you have the brown and blue Spare filter Pouches?
I find them from time to time as Afrikakorps or Luftwaffe at brit. dealers sites and Shops. Cover the date with a Name and they're 30 Years older.
Nico

[uscob]

For the Helmet is also a Strap system available to fix a Lamp to it.
the Lamp comes with an external Battery pack for the Belt and a Cable to the Lamp, like a miners Lamp.
Nico
BTW, the Chinstraps come in Black Leather, blue webbing, white and clear Plastic.

[uscob]

Wow! Frank, I learned more from you about ZB/ZS uniforms than everything I previously knew put together. Thanks very much for that!

What pieces am I missing for my 1963 uniform? I can see the the belt is one. I expect I won't easily find one of those! I have the black "double fang" belt marked ZB, so I guess that is OK. I have the goggles and until today I did not know they were ZB related.

What is the pouch on the right of your mannequin? Is that the breadbag?

Today I purchased what appears to be near brand-new condition ZB canteens in both blue and khaki. The seller thought they might be BW TruVsu, but of course we know differently

Steve

Yes it's the breadbag.
Good to see the Pic of the Mannequin, These are Belt's, 2 month ago I got 200 of them and thought that they're Equipment Straps or so. Now I have to find the box to get them sorted. Not easy with 4000 boxes in different storages.
Nico

[hoover]

BTW, the Chinstraps come in Black Leather, blue webbing, white and clear Plastic.

Hi USCOP. You forget the green canvas chinstraps.

You have 200 of the blue webbing BLSV-belts? Hell, I need 2 of them! I am afraid you can supply every collector in Europe and the US with them.

I am still looking for every kind of hats and caps for my mannequins. Maybe you have some for sale?

I hope that I can take some pics this evening of my helmets and the other pieces.

[Asbjoern]

...allways the same problem with this special kind of stuff. More then rare for ages it turnes up in large quantities because a depot (or, in this special case, a long stored stock of one trader) is cleared out....

Jens

[uscob]

Hi USCOP. You forget the green canvas chinstraps.

You have 200 of the blue webbing BLSV-belts? Hell, I need 2 of them! I am afraid you can supply every collector in Europe and the US with them.

I am still looking for every kind of hats and caps for my mannequins. Maybe you have some for sale?

I hope that I can take some pics this evening of my helmets and the other pieces.

Never had or saw green chinstraps, so I didn't posted them.
the Early Leather ones are quite rare. I my friends Storage I found only 30 Helmets with them in a bunch of only 3500. Maybe I have a pic of them in the barracks. It was an old house in a STALAG full of them. Years ago I posted Pics with DDR Stuff filled up to the ceiling. One Room with VP male trousers, one with female, one with male tunics and so on....
Others were filled with Canadian stuff in the same way. He told me that he bought a lot of BD's Summer Uniforms, Both Army and RCAF. For example 168.000 BD Trousers in Army khaki, 120.000 AF blue etc. Here I also got hundreds of them.
Nico
P.S.: Can't remember Caps, but that means nothing. Everybody who knows a bit of my storages will understand it.

[hoover]

Maybe I have to come for cleaning up?
I would like to make a shopping tour (with paying, of course).

I found the time to make some fast pics.


Luftschutzhelm 1st Pattern with white plastic chinstrap


Same type with grey webbing chinstrap


Same type with black leather chinstrap


Second type of the Luftschutzhelm. It was modelled after the B/II Steelhelmet from 1945 (same sample the NVA used for their steel helmets).
The helmet was used from 1973 on until the 90´s.
I have 3 of them, one with "Post"-Stamping from the Postschutz.


Same type as a helmet for Brandschutzdienst (fire service). A mesh wire was thought to held back the flames (called Flammschutzgitter). A leather neck piece protected the back. But the helmet proved to be not safe in fire...it was made from plastic.


In a fire service station cellar I found some originally packed M56 Zivilschutzmasken, still in carton.


The leather belt were not always stamped with ZS. The Fire service hat the same belts, as like some of the medical services.


The khakigrau spare filter bag. I have some in khakigrau, but the most are in grey.


The stamp in the flap.


this manneqiun portays a medical aide (Helfer in einer Sanitätsbereitschaft).
It is the uniform of my father. He started as an aide and became a truck driver later (driving flatbed trucks AL-28 from Hanomag and Großraumkrankenkraftwagen [large capacity casualties transort trucks] for 9 wounded, type Ford FK3500.


Here is the BLSV-stamping on a goggle.


The standard goggles were ZB or later ZS stamped.

Okay, that´s it for today.

[Collectinsteve]

USCOB,

I also am interested in what you find in your pile of boxes

Frank,

Thanks for more pictures. I think I've seen the bags for the goggles on eBay. Interesting to see that yours was made by RAKA. That is a Belgian company best known for producing camouflage uniforms for the Belgian Army. The use of foreign companies for early BW purchases, or making things for foreign countries, was fairly common because of war reparations. But 1965 the war reparations were complete (if I remember correctly) so it is odd to see a Belgian company's stamp on a ZB item.

Steve

[uscob]

Hoover, is that a promise? I can lock you in for 2 Weeks and I sware, you didn't went through every Box in that time.
Nico

[hoover]

Hm, in the early 90´s I cleaned up a NVA-Rocket Arty Bn in Havelberg. I really cannot believe that you have more boxes than there.

Oder doch?
@Steve:
I have looked to my bags and found some gasmask bags stamped by RAKA, too. I didn´t know that this is a Belgian firm.- Interesting.

[Asbjoern]

stamped by RAKA, too..

...and I`ve seen some BW snow-camo-ponchos made by RAKA in the early 60ies ...

Jens

[Gordon Craig]

Gentlemen,

Time for me to add some more of my THW/ZS items to this thread. First up, a THW M43 style cap.

Regards,

Gordon