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**Guardian 5** · 09-17-2007, 08:08 AM

Originally posted by gordon.criag View Post

G5,

Thanks for the pic of the patch. I found a BW uniform here is Budapest with the velco backing for the patches worn in Afghanistan and have since added the patches to the uniform including the name tag etc. The one patch I haven't been able to match is the unit patch on the left sleeve which has a specific shaped velcro backing that I have not been able to find a picture of. I'll have to check the Visier page you sent and see if there is anything of use there.
I am interested in almost everything in the Visier magazine so don't know what articles to ask for. The only copy I have has some great shots of the very early camo uniforms and those article would be of the most interest. If you see any more for sale I would be greatful you would pick them up for me. I've never seen any for sale in Germany but I really haven't looked lately. I'll probably be in Berlin later this month so I'll look then.

Regards,

Gordon

Gordon - Check out the below website to see a wide selection of BW battalion and company level patches. I haven't had any luck buying off this guy yet (unreturned letters and e-mail). If you see something you like, you may have better luck as you are based in Europe. In any event, a very educational site.

Take care - TJ

http://www.frankhummel.de/patches2.html

**Guardian 5** · 09-18-2007, 06:22 PM

Good hearing from You

Originally posted by Klaus1989 View Post

I have bought a few Bundeswehr items as a side to my NVA, and to lesser extent TR, collecting hobby. But these field jackets put my unbadged ones to shame! I also have a 1950s dated tan BGS breadbag, helmet net for the BGS helmet, and a complete Zivilschutz gas mask can set (not sure if they count or even what they are exactly). Couple of flecktarn items too.

Klaus

Hi Klaus - I ended up stationed in Germany for 6 years with the U.S. Army, which was a great advantage for a BW collector like me. Collecting was only a small aspect of this wonderful experience. Best of all I was priviledged enough to live with, train with and drink with some of the finest soldiers in the world. I would see many of them again in trouble spots all over the world from Bosnia to Afghanistan.

As is true of any collection, you should have a goal in mind. What is your collecting goal?

My goal is to obtain the complete combat kit from boot to helmet worn by the three different German armies (WH, NVA, BW) from 1944 - 1994. I set my goal back in 1992 and I'm not there yet. As we all know however, the hunt is more fun than the actual find!

At least with the WH and NVA, you know what to look for and there are plenty of vendors catering to those markets. Not so with the BW, and that's what makes it really fun. And don't even mention the BGS, THW, or ZD; there's next to nothing written about them. As for specialized vendors with a wealth of knowledge and a wide variety of goods, forget about it.

I wish you the best in your "West German" collecting efforts and look forward to hearing about your latest finds.

Take care - TJ

**Gordon Craig** · 09-19-2007, 07:53 AM

TJ,

An interesting goal and one that should last close to a life time! Interesting to see that you are also interested in BGS, THW and ZD. I've put together some info on the BGS and the THW but next to nothing on the ZD. I'll try and dig out some URLs on the weekend. In the meantime, here is one for the THW. http://www.thw.bund.de/

Regards,

Gordon

**Guardian 5** · 09-19-2007, 06:12 PM

Thanks

Gordon - As always, I appreciate the info.

Thanks!

TJ

**Klaus1989** · 09-19-2007, 08:49 PM

Guardian5: My collecting goal is eventually the full kit for late 1950s BGS and NVA. I have a few of the BGS fieldgear pieces and have seen the early tunics every now and then but was not interested in them until more recenly. They are always missing insignia for some reason and the sellers think they are some kind of WH tunic.

THW and ZD use the same helmets I think. They keep showing on ebay.de all the time as "Katastrophenschutzhelme" or something like that. I have also seen the ZD tunics come up on ebay.de and Manion's but very rarely (they are very cheap though).

Klaus

**Gordon Craig** · 09-20-2007, 08:25 AM

Originally posted by gordon.criag View Post

G5,

I take it from your comments that you do not have Hormann"s book. You have an alternative now. A lot of new books on the BW were published last year to celebrate the 50th anniversary of the BW. One of them was called Von der Affenjacke zum Troppen-tarnanzug by Robert Kunstwadl ISBN 10: 3-93285-24-1. This book covers the BW from start to the present. Lots of great colour pictures. I forgot to refer to this book yesterday when I posted my cap. It is in Kunstwadl's book and he says it was worn by the Bundesmarine and was introduced in 1963 in both enlisted men's and officers versions. The officers cap has gold trim.
Here is a picture of the cap in wear by the Marine.
G5,
I am having a problem adding pictures to my posts. I downloaded the latest McAfee software last night and now pop ups are blocked that allow me to post pictures. Frustrating. I guess you will just have to wait for the pictures until I can find a fix.
Anyway, the new book, and others in the BW line you may be interested in are available at;
http://www.zinnfigur.com/All/E_Home_Set.asp?sprache=EN

Regards,

Gordon

I've solved my pop up problems, at long last, and can post a picture of these hats in wear by the Bundesmarine.

Attached Files

DSCF3937.jpg (81.4 KB, 1136 views)

**Gordon Craig** · 09-20-2007, 08:27 AM

Here is a picture, from the book I referenced above, of the enlisted man's cap and the officer's cap.

Attached Files

DSCF3938.jpg (44.0 KB, 1134 views)

**Guardian 5** · 09-20-2007, 06:16 PM

Early BGS Gear

Originally posted by Klaus1989 View Post

Guardian5: My collecting goal is eventually the full kit for late 1950s BGS and NVA. I have a few of the BGS fieldgear pieces and have seen the early tunics every now and then but was not interested in them until more recenly. They are always missing insignia for some reason and the sellers think they are some kind of WH tunic.

THW and ZD use the same helmets I think. They keep showing on ebay.de all the time as "Katastrophenschutzhelme" or something like that. I have also seen the ZD tunics come up on ebay.de and Manion's but very rarely (they are very cheap though).

Klaus

Klaus - A man after my own heart! Attached find some pix of my late 50's / early 60's BGS rig.

I think I've only seen two of the early Forest Green "Ike" style jackets worn by the BGS in the 50's and as you experienced, both were missing a lot of stuff.

I've acquired some THW kit, but for now I'm focusing my efforts on the BGS, and of course, the Bundeswehr!

I have a fair amount of BGS reference pictures, let me know if you're looking to gather info on a specific piece of kit. I'm also saving up to buy the BGS reference book Gordon Craig mentioned earlier in the thread.

In the meantime, happy hunting!

Take care - TJ

Attached Files

Early BGS Field Gear.jpg (59.0 KB, 1124 views)

**Guardian 5** · 09-20-2007, 06:20 PM

More BGS stuff

Klaus - I've always wondered what the two of the two d-rings sewn onto the back of the battle dress are for.

Anyone have any info?

Thanks - TJ

Attached Files

Purpose of D-Rings.jpg (69.3 KB, 1111 views)

**Guardian 5** · 09-20-2007, 06:32 PM

More BGS kit

Here's another shot of some BGS kit. This time I've used the d-rings to secure a rolled poncho.

TJ

Attached Files

Purpose of D-Rings 2.jpg (67.0 KB, 1116 views)

**Guardian 5** · 09-20-2007, 06:36 PM

Cool Pix

Originally posted by gordon.criag View Post

Here is a picture, from the book I referenced above, of the enlisted man's cap and the officer's cap.

Gordon - The shot of the S- boat at sea reminds me of the boat Michael Caine skippered in the "Eagle Has Landed".

Thanks for taking the time to school me on a type of hat that I never knew even existed. Some BW collector I am!

Take care - TJ

**Guardian 5** · 09-20-2007, 06:40 PM

Early BGS Canteen

Originally posted by Klaus1989 View Post

Guardian5: My collecting goal is eventually the full kit for late 1950s BGS and NVA. I have a few of the BGS fieldgear pieces and have seen the early tunics every now and then but was not interested in them until more recenly. They are always missing insignia for some reason and the sellers think they are some kind of WH tunic.

THW and ZD use the same helmets I think. They keep showing on ebay.de all the time as "Katastrophenschutzhelme" or something like that. I have also seen the ZD tunics come up on ebay.de and Manion's but very rarely (they are very cheap though).

Klaus

Klaus - Attached find an image of an early BGS field flask manufactured by Heinrich Ritter of Esslingen, the same firm that manufactured the wood laminate canteens used by the WH in the Mediterranean Theater.

This example is stamped "H.R.E. - 57".

TJ

Attached Files

Early BGS Field Flask.jpg (103.8 KB, 1281 views)

**Gordon Craig** · 09-21-2007, 01:40 AM

TJ,

If you are saving for a book, I suggest you go for the BW one I listed. The BGS book focuses more on history than photos which in itself is interesting if you can read German. Mind you, it is still worth having in your collection. The BW book covers stuff you will not find anywhere else.
As for the d-rings on the coat? Good question. In my experianece even the guys that were issued specific kit didn't always know what the surface mounted items were for!

Cheers,

Gordon

**Gordon Craig** · 09-21-2007, 02:10 AM

TJ,

I just took another look at the BGS book and there are a lot more photos in it than I remembered so go for it! Here is a picture of BGS in the field, from the BGS book, wearing their field gear similarly to the way you showed yours. Imposible to tell how they hooked on the shelter quarter but an interesting comparison for your photo.

Cheers,

Gordon

Attached Files

DSCF3996.jpg (103.4 KB, 1094 views)

**Gordon Craig** · 09-21-2007, 02:13 AM

And just to wet your appetite, here is the first picture in the BGS book.

Attached Files

DSCF3997.jpg (140.1 KB, 1096 views)

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