Wittmann's Headstone Stolen from la cambe.

[Jean-Loup]

For comparison, this is Billy the Kid's grave site. The cage was built as a consequence of the multiple disapearences of the gravestone.

[Coco]

What a shame...

I read the thread and was really amazed that this happened....

I was in Normandy a few weeks before the stone was stolen and made a picture....I have included it for comparison....

Best regards,

Coco

[JanC]

I am not discredit him him but I am always amazed what some members here in WAF are thinking about the German people.
During the war, those soldiers were made heroes by the propaganda. And many of them found themselves "used" by the regime and did not like it.

After the war, it had to move on. The majority was NOT interested in any war heroes (by the way: How do define a hero ?)
Over 5 million young soldiers had lost their lives, nearly every family was affected...all of them had their dead "hero" in the family.

If you are so keen to held up the spirit (as I saw you want to work towards a new gravestone):
Just donate money to this well-worth organization and post the payslip:
http://www.volksbund.de/en/volksbund.html

Looking forward to see your generosity towards the German heros.

Regards
Christian

And what about Sgt Basilone? He was made a hero by the USMC??? Don't think so. That guy was also used by US propaganda. This is just to keep up the moral of the population and the fellow troops. So every fighting nation did this. Don't be surprised what people on the WAF think about German people or soldiers...At the and it is the Wehrmacht Awards Forum. If I consider the German WW2 military as such, to me it was the best organised thing ever.

[ironfist]

not on

Such a shameful act .
more likely done be the left not the right.
There has been a lot of shock over this but do we complain over the many sites that sell (RELIC) items .Like dog tags and rusty helmets and iron crosses with bullet holes.
All these items well99% are grave robbed for the east all over the Russian front every week.
when these guys get a beep on the metal detector they show no care for the soldiers there often buried where they fell. Bones out the way hunting for the goodies.Is this not GRAVE ROBBING so to buy items like this will only add to the action.
I am glad to say I do not own any so I can have clean hands knowing I have not paid these people.
Before one or two of you go bonkers yes some relic items are just found. But as I have said much much more is just robbed. Hell just look at the Russians and the Polish doing it on you tube.
Here in the UK a war grave is just that even if its a ship that sunk on either side.regardless of age also.
Witman deserves a head stone as do so many missing men from every nation.
Regards Pete

[chrischa]

His grave is sacred, slightly less so to me than the graves of the British troops he was engaged with leading to his death.

I agree with compressors' sentiment, plenty of families have their personal heroes in their hearts not just the better known or better rewarded ones.

[compressore]

Some of you are getting what I wanted to say !
of course, its a shameful act to steal gravestone, of course the dead needs our respect. No question about this.
What I personally do not like it the way of argument that Wittman is so special so he need a special treat as he is a "war hero". This I completely deny.
The picture of a "war hero" exists in a very, very limited amount of people.
For me a war is producing victims.... there is nothing to celebrate, only to mourn.

This is my personal believe, even (or maybe because) working since many, many years in the defense industry.

[Chris Boonzaier]

Anyone who puts on a uniform to defend their flag when called upon to do so, knowing they may die any day, is a hero plain and simple. They should be looked upon with gratitude and respect. End of discussion. Herr Wittman is a hero, we could do well to emulate.

Does that include ISIS ? Where would the exclusion start?

Being Brave is one thing.... all soldiers can be brave

I like to think of a Hero as someone who is brave... but can at the same time hold his head up high because he was brave fighting for a cause that was just and true.

For me Nazi Germany does not make the grade.

I have the awards for plenty of German Heroes 14-18, and quite a few awards to brave Germans who fought 39-45...

It is not to insult the men who served 39-45, but their cause torpedoed their Hero status.

(Yes, I know Stalin was worse, Yes I know they were fighting the evil communists, yes I know not a single SS man was a Nazi, Yes I know black SS Panzer wrappers make even Hetro men think the weareres are sexy war gods, yeas I know they were fighting to save the world from a greater evil... I have heard the arguments for years... I agree to disagree)

[Chris Boonzaier]

P.S. having been online for many, years, I know the next post "my grandfather was in the Wehrmacht!"

I am sure he was, and it is very, very, possible that he was a good man, an honest man, and felft he was doing his duty... I would not disagree with any of that.... But the Nazis were a turd in the punchbowl.... it is not the fault of the punch that it has been soiled by the turd.... but it is still soiled.... In the same way, it is not the average soldiers fault, but the Nazis have tainted his service, no matter how brave and good the individual soldier was.

[JanC]

P.S. having been online for many, years, I know the next post "my grandfather was in the Wehrmacht!"

I am sure he was, and it is very, very, possible that he was a good man, an honest man, and felft he was doing his duty... I would not disagree with any of that.... But the Nazis were a turd in the punchbowl.... it is not the fault of the punch that it has been soiled by the turd.... but it is still soiled.... In the same way, it is not the average soldiers fault, but the Nazis have tainted his service, no matter how brave and good the individual soldier was.

And Eisenhower was a hero because he wanted to kill every single German Nazi...

Most of US and Allied troops were indoctrinated with this phrase.

The USAF bombed the hell out of the Belgian (and other European) cities in 1944 and killed thousands of civilians. The great cause was the Liberation and kill the bad German enemy...

The Germans were indoctrinated as much about their superiority and the creation of their Lebensraum and erasing the Bolchewism. After 1942 tide had turned for them on the Eastern front and they had to keep fighting to survive and the survival of their country. You have no choice in a dictatorship. I don't think (and I'm sure) they fought for fun during 5 years...

ps: my grandfathers his life was saved by a German Soldier in an ongoing US bombing in september 1944. He went feeding his rabbits with his handcart. He had to cross the Railway and at that moment there was a German train loaded with vehicles and tanks passing by (came from France). The Allies rushed after the crossing of the river Seine into Belgium so there was a lot of activity in the air. The train was picked up by a P38 squadron. The train was strafed and bombed. He said the Flakvierlings on the train began to shoot at the planes. The planes opened fire and hundreds of 20mm and .50 cal shells fell from the sky dropped by the planes. A German soldier jumped of the train and shouted at my grandfahter "kommen sie schnell, geht weg dar". He took him by his arm and got with him in a ditch. At that moment bombs began to fall hitting the train. Tanks and vehicles turned over making a huge noise. A bomb fell right on the spot were he was pinned down with his handcart. He never found a piece of his cart back.

After the raid and after his fear he got out of the ditch with the German. The Germans pulled back Eastwards after the bombing. My grandfather took some .50 Cal shells from that attack that I still have today...

[JanC]

P.S. having been online for many, years, I know the next post "my grandfather was in the Wehrmacht!"

I am sure he was, and it is very, very, possible that he was a good man, an honest man, and felft he was doing his duty... I would not disagree with any of that.... But the Nazis were a turd in the punchbowl.... it is not the fault of the punch that it has been soiled by the turd.... but it is still soiled.... In the same way, it is not the average soldiers fault, but the Nazis have tainted his service, no matter how brave and good the individual soldier was.

And Eisenhower was a hero because he wanted to kill every single German Nazi...

Most of US and Allied troops were indoctrinated with this phrase.

The USAF bombed the hell out of the Belgian (and other European) cities in 1944 and killed thousands of civilians. The great cause was the Liberation and kill the bad German enemy...

The Germans were indoctrinated as much about their superiority and the creation of their Lebensraum and erasing the Bolchewism. After 1942 tide had turned for them on the Eastern front and they had to keep fighting to survive and the survival of their country. You have no choice in a dictatorship. I don't think (and I'm sure) they fought for fun during 5 years...

ps: my grandfathers his life was saved by a German Soldier in an ongoing US bombing in september 1944. He went feeding his rabbits with his handcart. He had to cross the Railway and at that moment there was a German train loaded with vehicles and tanks passing by (came from France). The Allies rushed after the crossing of the river Seine into Belgium so there was a lot of activity in the air. The train was picked up by a P38 squadron. The train was strafed and bombed. He said the Flakvierlings on the train began to shoot at the planes. The planes opened fire and hundreds of 20mm and .50 cal shells fell from the sky dropped by the planes. A German soldier jumped of the train and shouted at my grandfahter "kommen sie schnell, geht weg dar". He took him by his arm and got with him in a ditch. At that moment bombs began to fall hitting the train. Tanks and vehicles turned over making a huge noise. A bomb fell right on the spot were he was pinned down with his handcart. He never found a piece of his cart back.

After the raid and after his fear he got out of the ditch with the German. The Germans pulled back Eastwards after the bombing. My grandfather took some .50 Cal shells from that attack that I still have today...

[Chris Boonzaier]

And Eisenhower was a hero because he wanted to kill every single German Nazi...

Most of US and Allied troops were indoctrinated with this phrase.

...

Not unusual IMHO... they were fighting Prime Evil.... and did Eisenhower kill every single German Nazi... or did he stop once the shooting stopped?

The Allies DID have a great cause, I assume we are on the same wavelength there?

Its great your grandfather was saved by a german, as I pointed out above, many german soldiers were brave and good men... just not the cause they were fighting for.

[Tom B]

AGAIN ?? I thought they just replaced it......or is this another L O N G continuation of an OLD thread ???????

[ironcross13]

has it been replaced seen this on facebook

[Totenhead]

Michael Wittmann was a committed National Socialist. He killed a lot of good men defending their homelands and defending freedom. I have no respect or admiration for the man other than he was very good at his job using superior equipment. He died an honourable death in a country he had no right to be in the first place.

[Gary Jucha]

n

“Nazi” and “Hero” …. Impossible to find two other words that are so diametrically opposed.