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    #211
    Hi guys

    Thanks for all the extra comments that have been posted since last time.

    Now, 5 men from the grave have been identified thanks to their dog tags. 7 dog tags were found in total, but one was completely oxydated and unreadable. An other was readable, but the WASt was not able to decode it; I am not sure why. Maybe the documents of that specific Grenadier Batallion were destroyed??

    Additionaly in their archives the WASt found two names of men who were reported as MIA in Villeneuve Loubet. So in total, 5 men from the grave have been identified with 100% certainty, and 2 more were identified who were probably in that grave.

    Of the 7 men, only one came from a town that is still in Germany today; all the others were from what is now Poland or Czecoslovakia (I never could spell that name!). Because of this, the WASt has not been able to find relatives of a single of the 7 men yet, and probably never will be able to! I will give the WASt more time to search before posting the names here and making them public.

    I can already tell you that these were the ages of the men though: 17, 17, 19, 22, 23, 34 and 35.


    "I did some research and it's probably "Mother of God, Lady of the Scapular". As I found: "a blessing is upon the bearer and he should not be afraid of eternal retribution"."

    I can only hope for the owner of the medallion that his wish became reality.
    Last edited by Jean-Loup; 12-16-2007, 02:44 PM.

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      #212
      French castle

      This was a very interesting thread. Great work I wil look forward to your book!

      Comment

        #213
        What a great, great thread. Thanks Jean-Loup! I just came upon a youtube video of this dig:

        Exhumation of bodies of missing in action soldiers from WW2

        This is the text from the video page:

        This video shows the exhumation of the bodies of 14 missing in action German soldiers from an unmarked mass grave near Nice, France. These soldiers were killed in combat against the First Special Service Force (also known as Devils Brigade, a famous unit composed of a mixture of American and Canadian soldiers) on August 26th 1944; and were then buried in a mass grave by local civilians.
        After the exhumation, the 14 bodies were brought to the German military cemetery of Berneuil, in France. 4 bodies have been identified, and attempts are being made to discover surviving familly members. Of the 4 identified men, the youngest was named Hubert Pilch and was killed the day before his 18th birthday.
        All the bodies were reburied in Berneuil on june 23rd 2007, in the presence of 60 german famillies, as well as many french and german officials.

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          #214
          Here are the remains of an interesting object found in the grave, that was hard to recognise.
          It is a 10 Pfenig coin, with remains of a pocket rosary rusted on to it! Only about one third of the rosary remains, but the little bumps are very caracteristic. I put the image of a rosary found on google on the right for comparison.
          Attached Files
          Last edited by Jean-Loup; 03-01-2008, 03:29 PM.

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            #215
            I just cleaned this coin up today. Before cleaning it was totaly unidentifiable. I had the suprise of discovering it is a 10 centesimi Italian coin, with Victorio Emanuel III on it.
            So the soldier who had this coin on him had probably been to Italy at some point.
            Attached Files

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              #216
              I found this article today concerning the discovery of some Australian MIA in Viet Nam: http://www.defence.gov.au/news/armyn...s/centre01.htm
              The methods they tried and their pitfalls are very similar to what I experienced.

              PS, to Bill bellow, you might also enjoy this Viet Nam related site: http://www.topvietnamveterans.org/p-pe.html
              Last edited by Jean-Loup; 04-15-2008, 12:24 PM.

              Comment

                #217
                Thanks for the great article, it's always amazing that after all the years, bits and pieces of information, unreliable accounts, changes to the geography that they sill found these men, I do enjoy these kinds of articles. First thing I did was e-mail it to a friend who was in Vietnam.
                Thanks again,
                Bill

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                  #218
                  Thank you for a great article!

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                    #219
                    Remember this wallet found in the grave? It was found with a body that has not been identified. I decided it was time to do more investigations into it.
                    When the wallet dried, it cracked open, revealing a crucifix, and some coins. Today I decided to get serious!
                    Attached Files

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                      #220
                      I phoned the radiologist office, and told them I had some "archeological specimens" to be X rayed. An hour later, I was in the radiology office, staffed by aging females, who were all when they saw the young "archeologist" walk in.
                      The doctor in charge was also very happy to see something different for a change. They didnt even make me pay anything for the service!
                      We did several Xrays, with high power to be able to "see" through metalic objetcs.
                      Here are the results.

                      With the Xray, the crucifix and coins are clearly visible, but at least two, and apparently even four (probably) religious medalions are also visible. One crucifix and four medalions is quite a lot for such a small wallet, but unfortunately it didnt prevent the man from getting killed.
                      Attached Files
                      Last edited by Jean-Loup; 04-29-2008, 07:53 AM.

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                        #221
                        Here is a lighter view. The Xray is a "real" Xray, not a digital one, so I had to scan it, and take photos of it, but the result isnt great.
                        The religious medalions are recognisable by heir little loops to hang them from, that differenciate them from coins.
                        Attached Files

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                          #222
                          And finaly, a side view.

                          JL
                          Attached Files

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                            #223
                            Reading your thread was a touching and moving experience. Thank you for sharing your outstanding work and research with us. One question: What of the helmets and other pieces of equipment usually found in these graves? Are they buried with the remains - or what happens to them? Thanks again and greetings.

                            Comment

                              #224
                              The dog tags were all sent to Berlin. I got to keep most of the other items, though some things were taken by the curator of the towm museum as well.
                              You have to realise that we as collectors care and worry about what happens to helmets and belt buckles. Some of us want to "honnor" the dead by reburying them with a coroded helmet still on their head; others (like me) think that these objects should be preserved and studied. But to most people all the items are just rusted crap, and totaly useless.


                              JL
                              Last edited by Jean-Loup; 06-11-2008, 10:18 AM.

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                                #225
                                Originally posted by Jean-Loup View Post
                                The dog tags were all sent to Berlin. I got to keep most of the other items, though some things were taken by the curator of the towm museum as well.
                                You have to realise that we as collectors care and worry about what happens to helmets and belt buckles. Some of us want to "honnor" the dead by reburying them with a coroded helmet still on their head; others (like me) think that these objects should be preserved and studied. But to most people all the items are just rusted crap, and totaly useless.


                                JL
                                I'm one of them. He died with that helmet so I think all the stuff and personal stuff should stay with him. He was a soldier and was buried with all his belongings and the uniform where he was so proud of and died for.

                                Anyway, I like the way you do! Keep up the great work. How more will be revealed
                                Last edited by HouweTrouwe; 06-11-2008, 11:34 AM.

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