Rebluing antique weapons

[Seigfried]

Has anybody any experience in rebluing or rebrowning antique weapons?

I have a MkIII Martini Henry that I have just stripped down. The metalwork has reverted to it's silver base colour and I am considering rebluing it. The bottom half of the barrel which has been covered up is a beautiful dark blue colour, but I do not want the weapon to look brand new. I have seen a 'plum brown' type of finish promoted for antique weapons, but I am concerned as to the brownness! I am after a dark gun metal finish - any ideas?

[Jamz]

I guess you are gonna do it yourself? Leave the original there and try and match it with a cold bluing?
I have heard people swear only by Vans Instant Gun Blue. I couldn't find it locally and being impatient I wanted it now as most Americans so my next choice that got good reviews was G-96 Bluing Paste.
I only touched up some areas and doing the simple process over a few times was very satisfied. It gets a little darker each time (up to a point) and dosn't affect the original if you get a little messy.
The pretty deep blue is achieved by polishing the spot before you start with 0000 steel wool. I was able to buff some with my wheel for a shinny metal before starting.
My first attempt so I am amateur at best and others may have better ideas but for me, after searching comments on the web, it worked out. John

[MaxxBrunn1938]

Yeah redoing your self unless you have a place where you live that can do it. Here in Calif it's illegal now and has to be sent out of State. I'm re doing a Quasi G33/40 and I"m using Birchwood Casey, you just have to make sure the piece is really clean and buffed out .
Joe

[jtb1967]

I'm a big fan of Brownell's Oxy-blue. Unlike a lot of other cold blues, the base metal doesn't have to be 100% degreased. It will blue over fingerprints and light oil.

[BryanD]

Yeah redoing your self unless you have a place where you live that can do it. Here in Calif it's illegal now and has to be sent out of State. I'm re doing a Quasi G33/40 and I"m using Birchwood Casey, you just have to make sure the piece is really clean and buffed out .
Joe

Can't reblue a gun? That is the most stupid thing I have heard in a long time. It is legal to smoke pot for medical reasons but illegal to reblue a firearm. I wouldn't live in California for any reason.
No offense sir. California laws never cease to amaze me. I have heard it called the left coast of America and now understand why.

[Stahlhelm]

I agree that the illegality of rebluing guns in California seems terribly pointless. I can't even imagine what crimes this could deter. I suppose that a criminal is less likely to commint a crime, if his gun isn't properly blued?

Chris

[Ed Sunday]

The problem with with these chemicals is they are corrosives and very toxic. Cannot be done in a home atmosphere. I already talked with the folks at Brownells a while back and he asked if we were a commercial store front. These chemicals are all cradle to grave material. When they break down , someone like Safety Clean has to remove the hazardous waste. Were talking EPA if not disposed of properly. Becomes more of a problem with a home owner installing a hot tank gun bluing set up in the home. Granted some states are lax about rules but its changing fast. Over the counter blue is okay but it is what it is.

[Stahlhelm]

Okay, I can definitely see the point in outlawing the use of chemicals as deadly and toxic as described above. Case closed for me.

Chris

[Jamz]

We're bluing the gun, not jumping it.

[MaxxBrunn1938]

Can't reblue a gun? That is the most stupid thing I have heard in a long time. It is legal to smoke pot for medical reasons but illegal to reblue a firearm. I wouldn't live in California for any reason.
No offense sir. California laws never cease to amaze me. I have heard it called the left coast of America and now understand why.

Very true about CA, I've lived here since 1980 and in the last 15 yrs I've seen more and more STUPID Laws go into effect here I've come to the conclusion We've become the New Russia and our State flag proves it with the Bear and Red Star lol.
As for the Rebluing its do to the EPA here in CA . Shops can't offer it due to the chemicals involded. But yet you can go to a sports store and buy a rebluing kit and do it yourself.
They tried to past a new law this year on making it manatory for all vehicals regardless of age needed to be smogged, this was shot down by big collectors from Leno to our own Govoner.
So yes Ca has some stupid laws and people but I'm sure there are other states that are worse.

Joe

[phild]

Has anybody any experience in rebluing or rebrowning antique weapons?

I have a MkIII Martini Henry that I have just stripped down. The metalwork has reverted to it's silver base colour and I am considering rebluing it. The bottom half of the barrel which has been covered up is a beautiful dark blue colour, but I do not want the weapon to look brand new. I have seen a 'plum brown' type of finish promoted for antique weapons, but I am concerned as to the brownness! I am after a dark gun metal finish - any ideas?

The Martini Henry was probably blued with a process generally known as the slow rust process. The result was a deep dark blue as you describe. It takes expert skill and several weeks to achieve this process...not to mention the correct bluing solution.

ALL "over the counter" blue solutions are in the family of "cold blue". This is fine to touch up sights and such but it is a very very poor choice to reblue an entire firearm and should be kept far away from antique and collector firearms.

It would take about 10 pages of writing to offer even a survey of the major bluing types and how they work...what is important is that the only acceptable blue is the one that was orignally applied to a given type of firearm and all of these require expertise and usually major set up.

Generally any type of finish enhancement or restoration on an antique fiream will hurt the value and in many cases it will destroy the value ...Don't be ashamed of a firearm like the MH showing it's 130 year history.

[juoneen]

I agree, its always better to leave antique guns as found. My 2 cents worth is.. if you ever have to reblue, send it back to the company who originally made it, and only if its so bad that there is no finish at all. But most likely being english id say find someone in the uk that specializes in martini henrys. Youll have more in it to have it done correct than the guns worth in my opinion.Watch the sanding , as you can sand marks off that can hurt the value. Proceed with caution. If you have say a 1911 you want reblued because its all gone , send it back to colt, and have them do it correctly, including the prep work, and then you have a factory reblue, wich still retans its partial value, and also dont forget to get a letter from colt to show they did the work , and have them list the serial number in the paperwork.You Cant make something old.. new, best to find a good example from the start even if its a little more, than mess with guns refinshing , you cant send back to the factory. Cold blue always has a smell you can never forget, like death, thats a smell you also never forget. You might search the net to see if theres anyone who specializes in martinis refinishing, and maybe the guy will even be in the USA..Anybody remember when you could buy martinis for like 35.00 in the back of the guns and ammo magazines before the 68 gun control act. Ill bet it will cost between 3 and 600 to get it done as phild has suggested, hes telling you straight, and the other ideas are options, but could wind up looking and smelling farby, and youll have just a shooter at best. Good luck.

heres a link about the MH to see the finishes, n and by the way it says they were made originally by enfield.http://www.martinihenry.co.uk/ original formula is listed on the site if you want to try it the old fashioned way.

[phild]

You are so right about the smell! I have smelled cold blue in walking by tables with several cold blued guns on them at gun shows....and my sense of smell is pretty shot.

I will add that the British often used the term "browning" and "blueing" interchangeably...or the Americans used them incorrectly for 2 different types of finishes...whichever you prefer. In the excellent link jouneen attached, you will see both terms. The mixture give is probably for the slow rust (very deep blue) process. I will tell you that this is very involved and takes weeks to get a finish...it is very easy to make mistakes...but if done correctly it is very attractive. Buying or even making a solution is very easy...everything else is very involved and takes a lot of skill and attention.

[MikeP]

Why you want to ruin an antique this way?

Bloody murder IMHO.

Unless it's a total junker. Even then...

[ApathyL]

Hi Guys,

Well i have to say i restored this MP44 while I lived in europe, couldnt bring it with me it was an early one wit Mp43 stamp. I made the stock, the part that the stock goes into with which it attached to the rifle, the hand grips, the sling, and i removed all the rust..

hope you like the photos.


Cheers, Les.