There are plenty of idiots in museums but also people who set the standards and develop refined methods for conservation that are very professional. Good luck whatever you decide to do.
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Look before you leap...
Don't clean it. Too many times I have seen items cleaned with the best of intentions, only to be ruined in the end.
My suggestion to you would be to have Steve Mullinax, John Sexton or Rafael Eledge give their advice. They are very reputable and highly regarded in the Civil War collecting community.
Respectfully,
Michael CollinsComment
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Here is my CSA Plate;
Notice the green discolouration; it is a normal reaction and will not harm the Plate.
Enjoy!Comment
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This is a Non Dug example I acquired in a grouping from an Iowa Soldier.Comment
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Thanks
Pfalz;thanks for posting.
What it appears you have is a so-called "Atlanta Arsenal" buckle(though I personallybelieve them to have been made in Alabama;probably Selma Arsenal.)
It appears to be the notably thick("Atlanta") buckle-from what I can make of its thickness.
The green verdegris around the reverse prongs is pretty common.
But the buckle I have is an absolute green verdegris on the entire front & reverse(as you will see when pictures are posted)
I know these fellows you mentioned (Sexton only slightly)but they are relatively newcomers.I'm 65 and began collecting in the 60's with the "old timers" such as Bill Evans,Stan Phillips,Alphaeus Albert,etc.-back when buckles were around 75.-100.00 from diggers themselves(the grand old days!)
Thank you.
J.v.C.Comment
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My experience has shown that you are correct......There are people out there, who pose as "museum conservators", that take their "personal" expertise from other sources and pass it off as their own. There are many who give advice that is just plain destructive, as well.Originally posted by J.von Canon View PostThanks for your advice-but my experience with museums has been dismal.
Loaned a Confederate Bowie knife to the U.D.C. Museum in Columbia,S.C. years ago and when I came to retrieve it there was some sort of cleaning stain(looked like someone had dropped rifle bluing on the blade)and there I was feeling stupid for having loaned it...
I think the readers of these topics have a much greater actual knowledge of this subject than underpaid "curators" at museums(who are often thieves - but that's another topic).
Thank you one and all who have responded.
Peter-will send pics of (all) the Confederate belt buckles to you asap.
J.v.C.
I've found the advice on conservation in this forum, from members like Chris, to be well thought out and usually right on the money. Also, when Chris doesn't know the answer to something, he has the brains to SAY so, rather than offer a bad guess.....
I'm glad you chose to heed the advice here...
Cheers,
Bob.Last edited by bobcam1; 11-09-2008, 11:10 PM.I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous.....Comment
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JvC,
Thanks for the reply. I can tell you first hand there are many "Museum Curators" who are completely clueless. Your assessment was quite good on the description. However, I do believe this to be an Atlanta Arsenal variation. Upon close inspection, you can see the copper. Here's a top view showing thickness.
This Plate was tucked away in an Iowa Soldiers .58 Cartridge Box along with seven unfired Paper wrapped .577 Enfield Rounds...
Amazing stuff.
I would leave your plate alone. It is what it is and it has earned its' age spots...
Cheers.
Michael CollinsComment
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C.S.A. Buckle
Pfalz:
Yes;"Atlanta" or "Atlanta variation"-your buckle seems to be the thick version.Many of these buckles(like Wehrmacht badges)were apparently furnished to the Confederate Government by independent contractors & cottage industries.
I really like those file marks on your buckle,a characteristic often found on C.S.A. belt plates.Really personalizes it.
Your buckle has that "Atlanta" look.But,as I mentioned,I think that many buckles came out of Alabama(where the deposits of ore were at Elytown / later Birmingham)and probably(seems to me anyway) cast at the Selma and other neighboring foundries in the locale.
The term "Atlanta" and "Virginia",as you likely know,was a term given to the (2) main varieties of C.S.A. plates by the first diggers in the 1950-60 era.
But now we know that these 2 types were as common to the Western army(Army of Tennessee) as to the Army of Northern Virginia.
Was the Iowa soldier you mentioned in the West(Tennessee,Georgia)or do you happen to know which outfit?
We can continue(more in depth) this once I get the buckles posted asap.
Thanks again.Comment
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History
JvC,
The soldier in question was a member of the 16th Iowa. He fought at every major Western Theatre battle during the Civil War. He was taken prisoner 2nd day at the Battle of Atlanta and was sent to Andersonville Prison.
By a miracle, he was exchanged at Rough and Ready and made the March to the Sea.
When he mustered out, he paid $13.83 cents for his Springfield Musket, Catridge Box, Canteen (Which he drew water from the Providence Spring), Belt, Cap pouch with Percussion caps and Nipple Prick, Bayonet and Scabbard. In the Box was seven unfired Paper Wrapped Enfield Rounds and the C.S.A. Beltplate above...
An amazing find!
Cheers.
Michael CollinsLast edited by Pfalz DIIIa; 11-11-2008, 02:18 PM.Comment
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Michael,Originally posted by Pfalz DIIIa View Post
Great provinance!
Did you do all the research on this Iowa soldier?
The only thing that sorta jumps out is him being exchanged at Rough and Ready(south of Atlanta,near Jonesboro)which is remarkable.
Following the Battle of Jonesboro(which sealed Atlanta's fate)the generals (Hood & Sherman)had an exchange of prisoners that apparently did not go through Lincoln's Government(the Lincoln Gov't.REFUSED prisoner of war exchanges by this time)and the Iowa soldier had likely been captured either at Jonesboro or even the several major engagements around Atlanta.He was lucky indeed not to have spent any appreciable time at Andersonville.Sherman even had the recent Confederate prisoners captured at Jonesboro(where the Confederates of Hardee's Corps had literally been overrun)exchanged-some of these men were headed North to prison camps when recalled(by Sherman)and exchanged in the informal cartel between Sherman & Hood at Rough and Ready.This was one of the last prisoner of war exchanges before Grant/Lincoln stopped any further exchanges(resulting in horrendoussuffering by prisoners on both sides,unfortunately)
Very,very interesting.
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Posting these pics of J.von Canon's collection.....
PeterComment
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Even though it's not my area of collecting I'd say "nice buckle!".
I'd also agree with those who say "don't clean it".
If it bugs you that much why not just sell or trade it? I'd lay dollars to doughnuts that somebody would love to have that - green or not and you might be able to fill a hole with the trade or sale money.Thanks,
Eric GaumannComment
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