Shovel for review

[rick1]

I only know these "buckle on the wrong side" as post war (BGS or early nund ?? or NVA )

Tom
www.mp44.nl

Agreed!

[Guardian 5]

Can't really tell about the shovel.... but cover looks postwar to me.....

I only know these "buckle on the wrong side" as post war (BGS or early nund ?? or NVA )

here a picture of such a cover in use... are these BGS ???

Also nice to see the post war coconut canteens in use here as well as the light Zelts....



Tom
www.mp44.nl

MP44 Tom - Those most assuredly are early BGS, what an excellent picture. Shown below is a reconstruction of the BGS zelt/canteen/bread bag set-up, although my zelt is of the "marsh" variety as opposed to the early BGS splinter pattern worn by these gents.

Again, what an excellent photo!

I hope you don't mind me posting the photo on the BRD forum in an effort to get to the bottom of the great wartime/post-war spaten carrier debate. We've been having the same discussion over there as well.

All the best - TJ

[MP44_tom]

Hi TJ

Feel free to use the picture ! Nice setup, is that a war time cocnut ??

btw, do you know what kind of pouch the man on the left is wearing ?

Tom
www.mp44.nl

[Guardian 5]

Tom - As far as I can tell it is a post-war variation made by Heinrich Ritter of Essinglen am Neckar ("H.R.E."). Note the larger size of the BGS flask.

I've posted a side-by-side comparison photo below.

All the best - TJ

[Guardian 5]

Tom - Regarding the pouch, it appears to be a BGS issue flare pouch. Seeing as its wearer is an MG42 gunner however, some in the BRD forum thought the pouch may be serving as an ad hoc gunner's accessory pouch.

It could also be a purpose made gunners pouch of a style collectors have yet to come across and classify. There is alot we don't know about early BGS field gear, to include what kind of spaten carriers were standard issue.

We believe that the BGS used the straight handle e-tool and carrier until 1960 when they began being replaced by the Idealspaten folding e-tool (developed primarily for the Bundeswehr). We have further speculated that when the BGS was originally organized in 1951, some use was made of scarce wartime stocks. There was almost certainly however, a need to manufacture new kit to meet the needs of the rapidly expanding organization. There also had to be a need to replace worn out wartime stock, as the carriers would still be in use 15 years after the end of the war. We are learning alot about the actual BGS spaten itself, but there is still much to learn about the carriers. Your picture will help us on our journey of discovery.

Thanks again for the great photo. It caused somewhat of a stir on the BRD side as the tunics worn here are of a little known variation, as are the field boots. The latter could be mistaken for U.S. style combat boots.

All the best - TJ

[me6_130]

Hello again,

Please see this shovel on E-stand. Seller says it is Reichwehr model, and buckle is in the same side as mine, being the first date, so mine can perfectly be what I said it is: a Reichwehr shovel and cover.

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=467494

Carles