another late war canteen with brown cup!

[MULON]

16/17

[MULON]

17/17
Last,note the different model of this three different late war canteen.The right is the canteen of this topic.

[whsammler]

Fantastic!!!!!!!

[Grossfuss]

late war canteen with brown cup

Ahah!
So that's where it went!
I was bidding for it but really only for the cover and strap to fit on a late-war bottle of mine but it went through the roof.
Anyone know that marking on the bottle?
While on the subject - anybody got a spare late-war linen waterbottle cover complete with strap and bottlecap in really good condition? (Here's hoping?)
An interesting bottle nonetheless.
Regards,
Grossfuss

[MULON]

Hi,A friend of mine,ion italian forum,says that the brand is the original of a French factory still active in 1940.Great,really great

[Grossfuss]

late war canteen with brown cup

That's got to be a rare beastie then - worth all those Euros after all!
It's gone to an appreciative home!
All the best,
Grossfuss

[MULON]

Eh Grossfuss,
I'm a collector of feldflasche and at this moment I have 34, all different and some very rare.
In these days I must get one with passers leather riveted, I got on ebay to 4.5 € ..... and no joke.
Just get even this, posters all over the form of study, hoping that you'll like.

[Luciusdegeer]

Ciao Mulon,

this looks good to me for 75%. I will not bother you with criticism like 'this should be like that' or with the infamous 'textbook-example' dogma. I collect this stuff for over 20 years and I learned that there are almost as many differences as there are canteens to be found... Some elements are surprising and even worrying though:
1) Is the canteen body stamped with that commercial-like marking? Aluminium for canteen bodies is possible, even late war. But commercial markings I never saw on late-war canteens, only three-letter-codes or Reichsbetriebnr. (or no markings at all). This is the only part of your canteen that I'm not sure about. Sometimes malicious dealers (or collectors) switch steel painted canteen bodies (when they are rusted etc.) for similar ones in better shape (sometimes aluminium). Let's not forget that these canteen bodies were made until a few years ago (mostly in Eastern Europe) for all kinds of civilian canteens. You can find canteens like that on flea markets for 1-2 euro...
2) A brown cup like this one is certainly rare. The colour is typical 'Ersatz', just like the construction of the cup. There are no hinges attached, which is called 'Endsiegausführung' ('Last Ditch version') by some collectors. The cup itself is perhaps the most valuable part, as there are a lot of collectors who want this 'Ersatz'. I think that the canteen is assembled from various versions.
3) The strap is correctly made in 'Pecari' (pigskin leather), in two parts (typical for second half of the war). But the buckle is made with a 'roller' tube, which was discontinued is 1944. The cup on the other hand suggests construction in (very) late 1944 or even 1945. So assembled post-war?
4) The cover is typical late-war 'Ersatz', so this part is correct with the brown cup. The retaining straps on front and back of the cover are in correct 'Pecari'. I understand that there are no markings on cover, cup or strap? The markings on the snap fasteners of the cover are correct. Normally, canteens that are NOT re-assembled should have the same markings all over. This however changed towards the end of the war when the German armament industry changed into a mass of sub-contractors. So a late-war canteen could very well be assembled from parts that where made in four or more different places. This changes some of the above statements, I know...

Like I said in my previous postings, there was a considerable amount of German military equipment made after 1945 for some of the allied armies. I know that the French used German canteens up to the 1960's (Algeria), but I don't think they produced this (rather modest) piece of equipment themselves, like they did with some weapons (K98k) and spare parts of vehicles (PzKpfW V). There were however large numbers of German or 'Germanic-looking' pieces of equipment made for hikers and boy-scouts uop until the 1980's. The most famous example is the dagger I myself used as a boy-scout (I bought it in a regular hunting store as a boy-scout-knive)n, which really was a post-war copy (made by Herder in Solingen) of a Hitlerjugend 'Fahrtenmesser' (dagger)... But I saw bread bags (some hardly recognisable), fur backpacks (para-military style), sporks etc., and of course canteens, of which I saw at least five versions over the years. All made in post-war Germany (before the Wirtschaftswunder?), some even in the DDR. Some of these 'copies' (I prefer the word 'ghosts') are sold nowadays on I-bee for good money. These facts are not necessarily connected toyour question, I know. I just wanted to state thes facts, hoping to get some replies. I understand that you are an experienced collector, but there are some younger collegues who pay the money every day to cheaters like Ralph the Hare and others... I did too: in 1982 I bought a nice-looking canteen, that turned out to be a post-war DRK one. Tutor money, this is called over here. But in those days it was around 10 euros (canteen), now it would be 50-70 euros...

Greetings,

Lucius

[Luciusdegeer]

Mulon,
while I was writing my (long) reply you cleared the question of the aluminium marking yourself... Perhaps I should say that in that case the canteen could get a 100% from me. But a 1940 canteen body in a (very) late war canteen? I must say however that I myself never saw this French marking before, and I owned some 70 different canteens over the years... But the Ersatz cup and cover remain very valuable, just like the 'mint' Pecari strap!

Lucius

[MULON]

Hello Lucius,
say that I am an expert too.
I am one who collects and studies the bottles for almost 4 years, and I focused mainly on this subject.
You have given me many interesting ideas that I will have to study.
Unfortunately, I can write / speak English properly, and farelo use the transformer.
I understood almost everything that you said to me, I hope you do likewise with this transcript.
I can only thank you for all that I have said and you're ready I have many questions to get you in the very near future!
Thank you, thank you indeed.
MULON/GIancarlo.

[MULON]

Mulon,
while I was writing my (long) reply you cleared the question of the aluminium marking yourself... Perhaps I should say that in that case the canteen could get a 100% from me. But a 1940 canteen body in a (very) late war canteen? I must say however that I myself never saw this French marking before, and I owned some 70 different canteens over the years... But the Ersatz cup and cover remain very valuable, just like the 'mint' Pecari strap!

Lucius

But I have not said that it was produced in 40, but from a company that in 40 was still attiva.Probabilmente, I think / hope that was produced after 40.
Thanks again.
Wait a minute that the place my three baby ....

[MULON]

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[MULON]

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