An excellent summation (below by Pete) as to where we are with these.
The comparison photos in this thread are for me clear evidence that supports Pete's write up below. They are not German made, at least in the known SS facilities and therefore would be very suspect if they imitated the labor skills and manufacturing fingerprints exhibited by those facilities.....as we see so many fakes trying to do.
As yo Bob Chat's post about the stamps being used to "salt" the lot, I agree with Nutmeg's response. As someone who was in Europe when these were introduced (or a few months thereafter) and had many encounters with the dealers and buyers of these over there in the early 1980s, I can say without any qualification that the stamps hurt the sale and price of these. NO ONE knew what these stamps were or even if they were Russian . Most smocks had these stamps fully or partially removed and many never had them at all (from the bales??) there was no "salting" with fake Soviet stamps in 1980/81 as there was no precedent for these to mean to anything.
The stamps were often pointed out back in the early 80s and cited as a "bad sign" type of thing. Eight to ten years LATER items begin to appear in the West with similar stamps and in a few case identical stamps.......we knew what those were as we knew the people that had obtained these items in the USSR and elsewhere (like GP). For me that is when I started connecting those dots as to the purpose of the stamps.
It took until about 2010 or so to find a great example with all of the stamps clear and intact. That sample was known to me since the early 90s and came back from Europe with an American in the 80s....it was untouched. Several others have been found and photograhed since that time along with some other great and 100% original SS pieces with these same stamps.
Now, Nutmeg has established that this style of stamp and its content was in use during the the period (1940s) and beyond and a film house property accountability marking.....and he has established much more that seems to relate to these or at least to German uniform transfer between film houses and the Soviet war Dept.
The comparison photos in this thread are for me clear evidence that supports Pete's write up below. They are not German made, at least in the known SS facilities and therefore would be very suspect if they imitated the labor skills and manufacturing fingerprints exhibited by those facilities.....as we see so many fakes trying to do.
As yo Bob Chat's post about the stamps being used to "salt" the lot, I agree with Nutmeg's response. As someone who was in Europe when these were introduced (or a few months thereafter) and had many encounters with the dealers and buyers of these over there in the early 1980s, I can say without any qualification that the stamps hurt the sale and price of these. NO ONE knew what these stamps were or even if they were Russian . Most smocks had these stamps fully or partially removed and many never had them at all (from the bales??) there was no "salting" with fake Soviet stamps in 1980/81 as there was no precedent for these to mean to anything.
The stamps were often pointed out back in the early 80s and cited as a "bad sign" type of thing. Eight to ten years LATER items begin to appear in the West with similar stamps and in a few case identical stamps.......we knew what those were as we knew the people that had obtained these items in the USSR and elsewhere (like GP). For me that is when I started connecting those dots as to the purpose of the stamps.
It took until about 2010 or so to find a great example with all of the stamps clear and intact. That sample was known to me since the early 90s and came back from Europe with an American in the 80s....it was untouched. Several others have been found and photograhed since that time along with some other great and 100% original SS pieces with these same stamps.
Now, Nutmeg has established that this style of stamp and its content was in use during the the period (1940s) and beyond and a film house property accountability marking.....and he has established much more that seems to relate to these or at least to German uniform transfer between film houses and the Soviet war Dept.
Originally posted by pete
View Post
! The pink smocks are something else and therefore its hard to make side by side comparisons. Sewing method is of course interesting. The key holes on the pocket flaps on my M 42 (verified original - pictured in Beavers book) looks about the same as on the Pink smocks.
Comment