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    #16
    very nice items Robert
    Cheers
    Dave.

    Comment

      #17
      Originally posted by Stossgruppe3 View Post
      Thank you Gentlemen ....

      These are exactly the kind of answers I was looking for you obviously understood my questioning ... I have enclosed a couple of shots of the tabs I have ... once again these got the approval from the guys here on the forum but notice the number 3 another pattern that doesn't conform.
      Does anyone else have an opinion on these tabs the ones that started this post ?
      Whether it be a yes or no and are they acceptable ?
      Regards David
      These are early tabs as I'm sure you're aware, produced prior to the inception of the Reichszeugmeisterei. Finding variations of the number is the overall standard and in no way heteroclite.
      If I may revisit your first message, I forgot to address your question as to why a postwar copy would have a atypical number. I understand why it would make no sense for the faker to produce something made to fool that doesn't comply to a original pattern, but it does happen and quite often at that. I hypothesize this is a result of, A. the individual inability to produce a identified example or B. a individual's lack of knowledge of the particular item. Really, it could even be a result of a apathetic producer who knows most novice collectors can't decipher a original from a fake.

      Comment

        #18
        Originally posted by codytrcollector View Post
        These are early tabs as I'm sure you're aware, produced prior to the inception of the Reichszeugmeisterei. Finding variations of the number is the overall standard and in no way heteroclite.
        If I may revisit your first message, I forgot to address your question as to why a postwar copy would have a atypical number. I understand why it would make no sense for the faker to produce something made to fool that doesn't comply to a original pattern, but it does happen and quite often at that. I hypothesize this is a result of, A. the individual inability to produce a identified example or B. a individual's lack of knowledge of the particular item. Really, it could even be a result of a apathetic producer who knows most novice collectors can't decipher a original from a fake.

        Thank you for your reply ....
        Dare I ask especially as it has been established that the tab could well be an original item ... What about the buckram ?
        Does being a possible pre RZM affect the buckram too ?
        This is the only thing that would give me concern ... Over to you gentlemen
        Regards and thank you
        David

        Comment

          #19
          Originally posted by Stossgruppe3 View Post
          Thank you for your reply ....
          Dare I ask especially as it has been established that the tab could well be an original item ... What about the buckram ?
          Does being a possible pre RZM affect the buckram too ?
          This is the only thing that would give me concern ... Over to you gentlemen
          Regards and thank you
          David
          A great question and one I regrettably can't answer in depth. Though I have spent a considerable amount of time studying the overall characteristics of different buckrams, I can't recall coming across or anyone posting specific regulations on them, which is where the pertinent answers will be established. Quite embarrassingly, everything I know about them was achieved solely via studying different examples and that's not that helpful to anyone.
          What I can tell you, however limited, is the first example you posted does has a correct buckram and I'd approximate it was a product of ca. 1934-36 or so. I actually own a set with identical buckrams that are without question original.
          As to whether the production timeframe effects the style and components of a buckram,,,the short answer is yes. Though not entirely uncommon to find earlier examples on tabs of a "next generation" pattern, throughout the evolution of SS insignia there was clearly a established progression, and later on, deterioration in material, production and quality. The earlier ones tend to be almost a beige color while by the last years of the war they'd become almost a bronze-brown on a cardboard-like material at times. Of course, the weave and material changed many times as well throughout the years.
          My apologies for my inability to give you a adequate answer...I know this isn't exactly what you were looking for. Maybe another esteem member here can supply us with some specifics from different regulations and period documents. It would certainly be very much appreciated by myself.
          Last edited by codytrcollector; 03-13-2016, 02:04 PM.

          Comment

            #20
            Originally posted by codytrcollector View Post
            Maybe another esteem member here can supply us with some specifics from different regulations and period documents. It would certainly be very much appreciated by myself.

            You have been more than a great help ... Thank you Sir for your input
            Regards David

            Comment

              #21
              Two more pictures of the aforementioned tabs. Strange placing of the pips for a Oberscharführer or am I being a nitpick?

              Comment

                #22
                Originally posted by Christian J View Post
                Two more pictures of the aforementioned tabs. Strange placing of the pips for a Oberscharführer or am I being a nitpick?

                Can I ask ...
                whats your opinion on these tabs ?
                Regards David

                Comment

                  #23
                  Originally posted by Stossgruppe3 View Post
                  Can I ask ...
                  whats your opinion on these tabs ?
                  Regards David
                  As the current caretaker and having them in hand and seeing the material and construction up close I've least put so much trust in them to consider them originals.
                  Last edited by Christian J; 03-19-2016, 04:51 PM.

                  Comment

                    #24
                    Originally posted by Christian J View Post
                    As the current caretaker and having them in hand and seeing the material and construction up close I've least put so much trust in them to consider them originals.
                    Hi,
                    Looking at the reverse I assume that yours are the same ones as posted by David at the beginning of the thread Don't know what you did to the photos but in yours I'd say pass but in David's I'd say yes
                    Mark

                    Comment

                      #25
                      Originally posted by merdock View Post
                      Hi,
                      Looking at the reverse I assume that yours are the same ones as posted by David at the beginning of the thread Don't know what you did to the photos but in yours I'd say pass but in David's I'd say yes
                      Mark
                      Mark, just a ****ty cellphone and bad lightning. Says a lot on judging just by some pictures and having the items in hand.

                      Comment

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