comments on LAH officer's board cypher

[M Bando]

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I was offered this one today. It seems at first glance to be not quite as 'tall' as the ones in my collection. In certain other respects, some details look good. Opinions requested.

[M Bando]

reverse view


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As you can see, three long prongs on the back.

[markus]

About 2009 / 2010 fake sold massively thru Kai Winkler. Sorry.

Note the "drill-holes"....

Show us a photo of the reverse straight-on and not inclined.

[M Bando]

Beware of estate sale sellers

Just FYI-
Here's how that LAH cypher was purchased from an estate
sale by my friend:

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Now, I'm wondering about the 2 'DF' cyphers as well. One is minus
pins, while the other has two very long prongs on the back.

[markus]

Yep, still bad.

[M Bando]

Thanks for the info Markus

How many people would know the specific origins of these repros?
Valuable info-thanks.
This is certainly worlds better than the standard reenactor cyphers sold by
dealers like ATF, so I should put a pic of this in the book, because it is the
most-convincing repro I've seen. My first doubts came from the shorter total
height of the piece, but I noticed all the intended cutout places are cut-out,
something that isn't even done on all originals. So I thought, perhaps a manufacturer's variation existed that is slightly smaller in overall size?

Now posting a somewhat straight-on view of the reverse and now I see crude edges to the cutouts.


As to other examples, with perfectly round holes drilled in them, the debate
still rages about whether any of those are original. Some examples from
pretty prestigious collections were submitted for the Beaver book by guys
like Ray Embree, that clearly have numerous perfectly round holes drilled in them...just saying. Some collectors like Steve Pardon are absolutely convinced that examples with round holes are all postwar repros, but I feel the jury is still out on that subject.

[John Pic]

That is not one of the drilled holed cyphers sold by Winkler...it appears to have a flaw there but ist not the drilled type Winkler sold....The DF cyphers are also different than any real or fake ones Ive seen.

[Dr. Strangelove]

Cast Fake

Cast fake.

[John Pic]

I figured the casting caused the flaw...on the DF cyphers i do not want to reveal whats wrong with them but they are very different than real ones.

[M Bando]

Clarification-

Doc Strangelove- are you referring to the LAH cypher as 'cast' or to the
DF cyphers (or both?)

[tgn]

I figured the casting caused the flaw...on the DF cyphers i do not want to reveal whats wrong with them but they are very different than real ones.

John,
do you like this one?

[M Bando]

It seems there is a dispute

Markus and JohnPic disagree about the possible Kai Winkler connection.
I want to use the cypher that started this thread in the Beaver book, as an example of a known fake. Should I attribute it to Winkler or should it just be illustrated as a generic cast fake?

[M Bando]

also, just for the sake of discussion



This very salty pair of captain's boards was submitted from the Ray Embree collection for inclusion in the Beaver Insignia book. Is it just me or does it appear that some of the openings are circular, drilled holes?
Examples like this make me hesitate to classify drilled examples as postwar.

[Arran]

The best repro cyphers (these ones as posted above) are made in Budapest, to order, by some big German dealers...

[Dr. Strangelove]

Budaphest

I went to Budaphest, but I did not order Cyphers......great Town !!