SS M43 Trap.

[Perry Floyd]

Hows this one look from the picture? Anyone have this type of M43 in their collection? If so is yours maker marked?

[herrgeezer]

Hello Perry. I have one of these M43 trapazoids in my SS cloth collection. I think they are quite odd looking compared to the BeVo versions that were produced. Mine is an unissued example and is not maker marked. Which brings up the question - who did manufacture these pieces? The collector I purchased my piece from claims that it was 'liberated' from the Dachau clothing depot.

Is your trap sewn to a cap? Kinda looks that way to me.

All the best,
David

[Perry Floyd]

No, this one is off a M43 for sale at GDC classifieds. I was curious as to maker since these are only encountered on the black M43. I've tried to search if any of the Dachau M43's were maker marked, but so far nothing...

[Greg Domian]

As far as I know the Dachau M43's were only size stamped and came with this "pirate" trap...which I think is actually the best looking.


Greg

[Perry Floyd]

I've not seen a Dachau SS M43 maker marked in black, but have the green M43. Since no one has one in a collection maker mrkd, how about in a reference book? Angolia's Cloth Insigna book or Headgear of Hitlers Germany do not show one. Really no good pictures of the inside of one, maybe for a reason? Like protection against fakers?

[Paulh]

Trap

Hi Perry,

That is the M43 I was selling - already sold. I have specialized in cloth tks and traps for a number of years. To date, the Pirate trap has only been found on black material - no field grey has been encountered by anyone I know. Same thing for the 2nd version of the single row of teeth machine woven trap - it has only been observed in filed grey (green) - no black ones have ever shown up.

I have seen black traps being worn on field grey caps in period photos, which I have photo copies of. So, some insignia were mixed and matched - probably in the field.

All of the Dachau M43s, with Pirate traps I have encountered are only sized marked. Never have seen a maker mark in any of them.

Paul

[Perry Floyd]

Paul because you have never seen one maker marked (and neither have I) would you speculate then there was only one maker of the black "Dachau" M43? Could one maker during this time handle all the needs for supply of the black style? Or would maker marked M43's of the Dachau style be very rare?

[ReichsHeini]

makers

Perry,
These black caps which were amongst the booty at the Dachau Cothing Depot may have been manufactured in-house at one of the many concentration camps within the SS-BW auspices. (Ravensbruck,Oranienburg, etc.)
I would think by this late in the war, by the time this style m-43 came out, other rank caps would have been using an RBNr rather than a manufacturer name, if they were manufactured under contract by a private firm..

[Perry Floyd]

Are you saying just the black M43's or all the Dachau type M43's should have the RB# instead of a named manufacture stamp if they are maker mrkd.?

[ReichsHeini]

m-43 cap

I am saying that the Third reich was utilizing RBNr numbers towards the end of the war, rather than mfg stamps. Most late m-43 caps (enlisted) DO NOT have mfg. stamps. The black "Dachau" caps are all just size marked. NO RBNr and no mfg stamp. This fact sways me to think they were made by the SS-BW.
If they were manufactured by the SS-BW, they would have neither an RBNr or a mfg stamp. I don't think anybody can say who actually made these caps, but I tend to think these were not made under contract.
I have an early SS panzer cap that does have maker marks. It was made by a private firm, Carl Halfar. In my opinion, it is uncommon for any enlisted m-43 to have mfr stamp. Officer's m-43 were frequently marked as they were privately purchased.

[Paulh]

Caps

Hi Perry,

I would speculate that the Dachau panzer M43s with Pirate traps were probably either 1). Made at the camp or 2). The corresponding pieces were being assembled/sewn there.

Certainly other black caps were being made elsewhere, but probably were not having the Pirate trap applied. These would be some of the late war caps we see with individual tks and eagles or machine woven style traps. I would not expect to see a manufacturers name in these necessarily.

From what I have observed, caps with maker (manufacturers) names are often high quality private purchase caps. I have seen a couple of these for officers with various insignia combinations on them. My interest has always been the insignia. So, I am no hat “pro”.

Paul

[Perry Floyd]

Wonder why you will see a Dachau green M43 with a maker mark but not the black? Sways me back to the possiblity that only one maker made the black ones..

Guys whats your take?

[Perry Floyd]

Here's a maker marked green Dachau M43. Dated '44 and notice it has the makers name and not a RB# or RZM. I'll leave this pic up for a day or two.

[Gary Wood]

Perry,

Interesting thread, what is the makers mark in the dachau style m43? Probably not the forum to ask, but does this combination, with the underside of the peak being exposed appear on any other type of cap (HEER LW ect), in other words is this just an economy method used in the later stages of the war?
cheers,
Gary

[Perry Floyd]

According to Mike B. it's a known SS maker. Now wether they made other items I'm not sure..

But this style of M43 is solely that of the Dachau style SS...