As for the star, I think it could have been sewn years after the inmate left the KL, so as to wear the stripped uniform in commemorative acts or so. I don't think the star is the most important thing here. The important thing is the uniform and the triangle and patch with initials. As well as the back lettering. The star is obvious that was not used during the captivity. We must concentrate on those things I think. It's easy to say that a KZ item is a fake because there are many of them all around, but what if we have an original item in this thread? Really difficult to tell.
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Total junk in my opinion.Comment
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Originally posted by Gaspare View Post
Gaspare:
I have to admit, it drives me crazy too when I read answers like my own in threads that I have an interest it.
To publically detail the "hows and whys" of why this piece is not legitimate, will directly serve a specific element whose only motivation is money. Take a look at what recently took place in regards to the legitimate Buchenwald KL Soldbuch that was posted here a while back.....within a matter of months of posting here on the WAF, a copy of that Soldbuch (right down to the lazer cut KL stamps) is now on the market. Unfortunately, any detailing of the issues this shirt has will only make the KL Shirts that follow this one (and there WILL be more) that much better.
What I will say though is some good points in regards to the "issues" this piece has have been brought up in this thread....
*** Interesting that not one person has commented on the "J.V.A." patch....if would be interesting to hear what others consider it stands for....also, look closely at the "J" and the "A"....notice any similiarities ???
"Hundestaffel"Last edited by Hundestaffel; 01-11-2010, 03:55 PM.Comment
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A pic from an inmate of KZ Mittlebau-Dora after liberation.Comment
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Hundestaffel, it's really difficult to say what those letters stand for. Maybe the name and surname of the inmate. Or some kind of codification. J might stand for Jude? Mittlebau- Dora was an Arbeitslager where the V1 and V2 were manufactured. That shirt must have belonged to a prisoner who worked there, so that patch with letters could be something related to the labour he did or the rank he had into the workshop (if they had...). However, as I've seen in many other KZ uniforms, in those patches just above the triangle, it was shown the id. number of the inmate... But I repeat, that was a place were a there was a factory for manufacturing V1 and V2 with slaves. If we had any other example from Mittlebau- Dora...
Originally posted by Hundestaffel View PostComment
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"Really difficult to say", "maybe", "could be something related to", "or some kind of", are not words or statements that I personally would want to be basing a purchase on.
Again, look very closely at what you see here....
"Hundestaffel"Comment
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*Hund,, I understand,, I haven't read the soldbuch topic,,I will though as I've stopped playing with them in 95 after seeing some scary ones in Ukraine using authentic soldbuchs and stamps!!.
I will make a statement that this type garment was worn at that camp. I'm not sure about material, buttons , stenciles or anything else..
*Wagenrad,,,where did you get this shirt?Last edited by Gaspare; 01-11-2010, 05:47 PM.Comment
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But it's nearly impossible to say from the pics. If I could touch it, or even smell it... In many cases, people claim that an item is not original and then it is. Then an item which is said to be original turns out to be a fake. Nowadays fakes are incredibly good. Who has the capability to determinate whether this item is original or not from those pics? I don't think that shirt was made for any film or documentary. The buttons seem to be old as well as the sewing. But? That's not enough I think... I cannot state: That shirt is a fake or that shirt is original. We are talking, maybe, about most faked items related to III Reich militaria and other items.
Every time a KZ or Holocaust related items pop up, many people say: FAKE! Why? It can be a nice original. But the tendency is not to believe that the item is original. 
Originally posted by Hundestaffel View PostComment
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The dress in question.....its for a female, is IMO a put together peice. The JVA is very odd and so is the star of David.
Once again I will say....this is a womans dress NOT a mans shirt.Comment
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Interesting input David. I didn't noticed that... I thought men also used those kind of long shirts in some cases. As there was not a regulation regarding clothes... I mean, some shirts have different type of strippes (wider or thinner). The star of david is, IMHO, a post war issue. But the important thing is the shirt and the triangle as well as the patch.
Originally posted by David Fettes View PostComment
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Its much too long for a shirt and the buttons are the "female" way round.
The star is bogus and applied post war.
The triangle if red could be ok but if it is pink then it is again post war applied.
The JVA IMO is also post war applied as the V and the A are made from the same stencil, (ie all letter done one at a time) and not a three letter stencil which would have been used if these labels were mass produced.
I feel we are looking at a womans dress (or even a womans nightie) tarted up and aged to look original.Comment
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IMO it is a vintage European womens hospital gown which has been modified. It could be a period garment but I do not think the stencils and insignia are original.Comment
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And what if the dress is original from a female who was in the camp and then the id. number was changed for a cloth patch with the initials of the name of the inmate as well as the star was post war addition but to be worn for commemorative acts and anniversaries? I mean, a mixture of pre 45 and post war items? Remember that many of the inmates who had their uniforms, wore them in special occasions, somtimes with yellow stars sewn and other patches.
Originally posted by David Fettes View PostComment
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The first thing I learned after getting burned on WWII items is that if you need to create complicated explanations and "what ifs" it is better to walk away. IMO the math as far as the chances of this being real is enough for me to assume it is fake not to mention there is a cottage industry manufacturing things like this.Comment
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You are right Johnny. When somthing makes you doubt... Depending on the object, sometimes it is worth risking, but it depends on what. The best option when you buy an item like this is to have even a pic of the inmate with the cloth or having received directly from the relatives. That's the only way to be sure the item is original.
Originally posted by Johnny R View PostComment
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