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**Johnny R** · 09-07-2009, 07:57 AM

The dollar DM exchange rate matches for that week. I never knew you could do that. Odd, I would think it could only have been cashed on a military base.

**Robert H** · 09-07-2009, 10:18 AM

possible in a base that is right, but honestly I don't care for anything about this nor Pichl ...

**sszza2** · 09-07-2009, 10:44 AM

Originally posted by Vid View Post

If one were to have some form of devious intentions, why would they write on the check 4 reproduction Honor rings and leave a trail.

On the other hand, why would a dealer take in in excess of 80,000 in cash through the U.S.P.S and refer to it as a "boxes of cake" , "Cashola" or other terms. Guess that guy would not have to worry about a memo note.
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Nah, I'd rather have the cash. I sort of thought, based upon our phone conversation, that you were going to send it in a box, like before - would this be a terrible inconvenience? I know it's easier to send the check, but as you can imagine, I'd prefer the cashola. Express Mail would be fine in the next few days or early next week, if you can swing it. Thanks in advance, and look forward to seeing you at Louisville.
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Also,
can you give me word on my "box of cake" that's supposed to be coming my
way?

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It's got a MINT
blade, no leather problems, and a nice patina. $3500 check or $3000 cash.
Expensive, but you'd be the only guy on the block with one.

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These are one customer, there is another 50,000 in cash and an 8500.00 loss to a buyer who had to fight for his money for months.

Lot of cash here, a real lot. There is 20k in one month and that is what I can account for myself.

Want to post personal information?? I have more.

This is information for USPS Inspection and IRS Criminal Investigators to see. This also falls under DHS as it suggests money laundering. But then perhaps they already have it...

Something needs to be done about this sniveling filth!

**kingtiger** · 09-07-2009, 01:31 PM

Where is the "dealer"

It seems there is no retort from the dealer on these statements? What should we assume?

The MAX should prove very interesting and icy for this fellow.

**MaxxBrunn1938** · 09-07-2009, 02:27 PM

[QUOTE=Chris_Werner;3470475]This whole deal just pisses me off, and not just the Craig controversy.

But as is inevitable, the hobby broadened and became popular. Too many dollars were chasing too few items. Newer collectors were divorced from the original chain of possession, and our memorabilia became just that, units of value, and marketed and sold as commodities. Don't get me wrong, I do not question the interest or motivations of 99% of the newere collectors, who are just as motivated by a respect for history, and a desire to honor and preserve memories of those terrible times. Yet, the hobby changed in character.

A new generations of dealers, with internet sites, picker networks, etc. arose to corporatize the hobby. Marketing became important as prices rose like a barrel of oil. Wealthy collectors got into the game and it became a rich man's game as far as top of the line collectables. $11k for a WSS M-36 DD, indeed! A similar thing happened with american muscle cars, which used to be restored in middle class garages, and raced on the weekends. that hobby changed and became a rich yuppie game for the most part too. (Yeah, I know. Sour grapes from an income challenged collector.)

I have too also agree with you on this to Chris, my first items in my collection were family vet brought backs which I still charise to this day with what I still have. I started buying items later from Flea Markets, Army Navy Stores and Antique Shops in my youth from the late 1970s t0 1980s when alot of it could still be gotten cheaply. I put up my collecting reins in the mid 90s and have only recantly started to collect again and am blown Away by the Rip Offs and Bull Turds I have to now deal with,just about everyone is about the Almighty Dollar now and don't really give a Crap about the True Meaning of Collecting anymore..

**Felix** · 09-07-2009, 03:10 PM

Originally posted by Chris_Werner View Post

This whole deal just pisses me off, and not just the Craig controversy.

To me, what has happened to our hobby is a microcosm of what has happened to the USA and many other countries as a whole. We have been turned into sheeple who should "baaa" and herd to the latest corporate marketing initiative. I knew we were in trouble when we had the first "Dorito's Superbowl." Excuse me, but football does not belong to a freaking chip company. It belongs to football fans. It seems like anything and everything is up for sale to the highest bidder, and those of us who have to endure it didn't even have a choice about signing in to play this game.

So what is my point? Simple. The same thing has happened to our hobby. when I started collecting in 1968, collecting was a family affair. The items you cherished came directly from loved ones, and each had a story. If you bought something, it was usually one step removed from the actual owner. Collecting was as much an activity of memory cherishing, love, and respect for what was symbolic of a time of war and survival.

But as is inevitable, the hobby broadened and became popular. Too many dollars were chasing too few items. Newer collectors were divorced from the original chain of possession, and our memorabilia became just that, units of value, and marketed and sold as commodities. Don't get me wrong, I do not question the interest or motivations of 99% of the newere collectors, who are just as motivated by a respect for history, and a desire to honor and preserve memories of those terrible times. Yet, the hobby changed in character.

A new generations of dealers, with internet sites, picker networks, etc. arose to corporatize the hobby. Marketing became important as prices rose like a barrel of oil. Wealthy collectors got into the game and it became a rich man's game as far as top of the line collectables. $11k for a WSS M-36 DD, indeed! A similar thing happened with american muscle cars, which used to be restored in middle class garages, and raced on the weekends. that hobby changed and became a rich yuppie game for the most part too. (Yeah, I know. Sour grapes from an income challenged collector.)

But the pressures on the hobby became the same as the pressures on the banks and insurance companies. Money, money, profits, income streams adequate to outbid other dealers on items that could be resold to the "right" collector for dizzying profit. So the fakers became first rate in order to satisfy a new breed of collector. The pressure was on to produce more stunning items to sell. the pressure caused corner cutting and ethical lapses.

A new breed of authors and researcher brought good and bad to the hobby. The internet taught good lessons, but it also spread lies and false information. Dealer "Gods" arose and fell. New ones rise as we go on. "Founding fathers" of the hobby, and famous authors of collecting books sadly became exposed to be unethical crooks, who used their reputation to flog fakes to people who trusted their ethics and reputation.

So our hobby has to keep moving forward. But we are at a corner, an intersection. We have to decide if we give in to our baser collecting urges, and buy from the devils, so to speak. Or do we turn our backs on those who target and market to us as sheeple, militaria drug addicts.

We need to take a stand against fraud, and people who would exploit our love of history and a desire to honor memories, in the name of profit at any cost. I do not want to disparage the ethical dealers who enjoy the hobby as much as we do. But the Bernie Madoffs and Ken Lays MUST go.

Well said!

I can hardly afford to stay in the rat race (or dollar race) any more! Though it is my passion!

//Felix

**Vid** · 09-08-2009, 01:07 AM

Originally posted by sszza2 View Post

This is information for USPS Inspection and IRS Criminal Investigators to see. This also falls under DHS as it suggests money laundering. But then perhaps they already have it...

Something needs to be done about this sniveling filth!

sszza,

I always found it funny when people fired off attorney letters to shut something down, it scares people. In this case just the threat or a letter folded a hearing on issues that were in direct conflict with a program. They ran from 15k maybe a tad more, who knows. But they ran.

No, this will not do and if a dealer wants to threaten other dealers, I guess that is his or her choice, maybe its just an excuse to bail out and go back to business as usual.

This market is ripe for change and its coming, and these little snippets and such lead to bigger issues. And maybe it is boring some people here, but not for long.

So here is a message for collectors! Do not send cash through the mail, and if the dealer assures you that it is safe, I can assure it is not. If he persists with promises of insurance coverage?. Collectors Insurance Agency does not cover cash.

If you are asked to send a letter or mail prior to a cash dispersal via mail regarding an item that would be covered in case of a loss, be advised that such an action would make you an accessory to fraud if there is an actual loss and a claim.

Explain to me why a dealer would want a letter or an e-mail regarding the sale of a dagger or another item to cover a cash payment in case of loss. Is that ethical??. Its a flat out scumbag maneuver and part of the reason the premiums have risen on collector policy's. And it is happening.

So? send me lawyer letters please, I will respond, just not the way you expect. And 15k??? I am looking at the items for sale and the price tags and I cannot see running from 15k. Ill get that 15k or whatever it costs because that is what needs to be done.

I do not think people realize what is actually going on here, its not Honor Rings nor is it lifetime guarantee's. Its a game designed to take your money. Take the hobby back, its yours.

**Scott A. Hess** · 09-08-2009, 02:28 AM

Originally posted by Vid View Post

sszza,

I always found it funny when people fired off attorney letters to shut something down, it scares people. In this case just the threat or a letter folded a hearing on issues that were in direct conflict with a program. They ran from 15k maybe a tad more, who knows. But they ran.

No, this will not do and if a dealer wants to threaten other dealers, I guess that is his or her choice, maybe its just an excuse to bail out and go back to business as usual.

This market is ripe for change and its coming, and these little snippets and such lead to bigger issues. And maybe it is boring some people here, but not for long.

So here is a message for collectors! Do not send cash through the mail, and if the dealer assures you that it is safe, I can assure it is not. If he persists with promises of insurance coverage?. Collectors Insurance Agency does not cover cash.

If you are asked to send a letter or mail prior to a cash dispersal via mail regarding an item that would be covered in case of a loss, be advised that such an action would make you an accessory to fraud if there is an actual loss and a claim.

Explain to me why a dealer would want a letter or an e-mail regarding the sale of a dagger or another item to cover a cash payment in case of loss. Is that ethical??. Its a flat out scumbag maneuver and part of the reason the premiums have risen on collector policy's. And it is happening.

So? send me lawyer letters please, I will respond, just not the way you expect. And 15k??? I am looking at the items for sale and the price tags and I cannot see running from 15k. Ill get that 15k or whatever it costs because that is what needs to be done.

I do not think people realize what is actually going on here, its not Honor Rings nor is it lifetime guarantee's. Its a game designed to take your money. Take the hobby back, its yours.

I would imagine because someone is gaming the insurance system, and collecting on both ends, possibly splitting the profits with a buyer who is in one the scam, or not. Thats just my conjecture, I dont know who is doing this, however, anyone who sends cash through the mail is an idiot, but since its probably being done as part of a scam, the only idiots are the insurance agencies who are not looking deeper into the claims. I would imagine the scam goes the letter confirms the cash was sent, which it is not, then the claim is made when the cash is lost. Im not totally sure, just thinking out loud.

**sgstandard** · 09-08-2009, 11:07 AM

Peich

Back to the subject of Peichl - Does ANYONE have the book, "PERSONAL DOCUMENTS OF THE SS"? (Charles Barger & J. Bowman, Imperial Publication, Lancaster, England) I believe this was published in 1991, 3 years before Don's book. I believe it has information on Peichl also. Can someone verify this?

**Thorsten B.** · 09-08-2009, 11:12 AM

Why don´t you just call Elisabeth Nickel here in Nordenham?

I bet she can speak English as well.

If someone may have yet undiscovered or unknown documents it ought to be her.

If nobody else other than Craig Gottlieb followed my advice and got in contact with her I cannot help - the fastest bird catches the worm - wether people like it or not.

**JoeW** · 09-08-2009, 12:01 PM

The Barger book mentions in passing that Peichl was in Germany, familiar with making the TK rings and still making them. No mention of location or former employment before or during the war.

Peichl was advertising in Der Freiwillige (the magazine for Waffen-SS veterans) in the mid 1980s as "Goldschmiede Peichl, Fr.-Ebert-Str. 91, 2890 Nordenham, ehem. G.v.B." The last italics means "formerly of the G<link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5CJOEWOT%7E1%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5 Cmsohtmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><link rel="themeData" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5CJOEWOT%7E1%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5 Cmsohtmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_themedata.thmx"><link rel="colorSchemeMapping" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5CJOEWOT%7E1%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5 Cmsohtmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_colorschememapping.xml"> <!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:TrackMoves/> <w:TrackFormatting/> <w:PunctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w

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ontVertAlignInTxbx/> <w:Word11KerningPairs/> <w:CachedColBalance/> <w:UseFELayout/> </w:Compatibility> <m:mathPr> <m:mathFont m:val="Cambria Math"/> <m:brkBin m:val="before"/> <m:brkBinSub m:val="******45;-"/> <m:smallFrac m:val="off"/> <m:dispDef/> <m:lMargin m:val="0"/> <m:rMargin m:val="0"/> <m:defJc m:val="centerGroup"/> <m:wrapIndent m:val="1440"/> <m:intLim m:val="subSup"/> <m:naryLim m:val="undOvr"/> </m:mathPr></w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--><style>  </style>ötz v. Berlichingen" in case anyone is confused.

**Hundestaffel** · 09-08-2009, 12:03 PM

Originally posted by sgstandard View Post

Back to the subject of Peichl - Does ANYONE have the book, "PERSONAL DOCUMENTS OF THE SS"? (Charles Barger & J. Bowman, Imperial Publication, Lancaster, England) I believe this was published in 1991, 3 years before Don's book. I believe it has information on Peichl also. Can someone verify this?

Sorry to cut in here, but this publication is one of the worst (if not thee worst) "Reference" (if one wants to call this Major League TURD that) books on SS ID's / Documents that has ever been printed. Full of misinformation, mis-interpreted information, and outright guess work, there's hardly a page in which there are not some serious mistakes. Only the photos speak for themselves (and they would have spoke louder if they were done better).

CAVEAT EMPEROR.

I'll now "Muzzle it" and head back to my Dog House......

"Hundestaffel"

**JoeW** · 09-08-2009, 12:11 PM

The book was a terrible waste of money I must admit. The photos are dark and simply worthless for the most part. But the reference to Peichl is still there, for what it's worth. I suppose Peichl was know to many in Europe and perhaps here in the US fifteen years ago and earlier. I have heard that his catalog offered TK rings, though I am not famliar with the design.

**Hundestaffel** · 09-08-2009, 12:25 PM

QUOTE=JoeW - The book was a terrible waste of money I must admit.

BULLSEYE, Onkel Joe !!!!

The authors of that Toilet Paper should hang their heads in SShame...

OK, now I'm done !!!

"Hundestaffel"

**nutmeg** · 09-08-2009, 01:53 PM

I have a question, if this guy was born in 1920 as stated above when did he start in the jewelry business, he would be only 20 in 1940.

I would think he would be low rung apprentice at that age.

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