SS Skull with Solid Eyes

[John T]

Hello All:

I would like opinions on this example...both pro and con are welcome.

The skull appears to be made of silver-plated tomback.

Thanks,

John

[John T]

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[John T]

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[John T]

4

[SgtB]

Although I'm not familiar with this variation, John, I hope it proves to be a good one, as it is probably the nicest looking cap skull I've ever seen!

[bwanek1]

It is the standard unmarked TK, which is commonly--but quite wrongly in my opinion--attributed to Deschler. In this case, my guess is that this came from unfinished stock, which was partially completed after war's end for GI souvenirs. Here is another example previously shown/discussed:

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=232965

[SgtB]

You may very well be right, Brad, but the eyes and nose would've been punched out first, and I have a lot of trouble believing GI's soldered those pins on. It does look just like the unmarked "Deschlers" but those that I've seen had open eyes and noses. If real, and I believe it is, IMO this is the way it was sold (or issued). A rare variant.

Unless the GI's forced a German metalsmith to complete his unfinished stock by soldering pins on and ignoring the punching-out step . . .

[PMan]

Skull

IMO, it could be possible this skull is one of the first 1934 versions to appear aside from Deschler or possibly from Deschler. It appears to be die stamped from brass or silver, which is inconsistant with later skulls that were made of CupAl, Tombak and Zinc. The detail is super which also says early, again just my opinion.
Peter

[bwanek1]

You may very well be right, Brad, but the eyes and nose would've been punched out first, and I have a lot of trouble believing GI's soldered those pins on. It does look just like the unmarked "Deschlers" but those that I've seen had open eyes and noses. If real, and I believe it is, IMO this is the way it was sold (or issued). A rare variant.

Unless the GI's forced a German metalsmith to complete his unfinished stock by soldering pins on and ignoring the punching-out step . . .

The process of striking TKs took three steps. The first strike created the basic front and back shape in a round planchet. The second strike removed the excess material around the outside. The third strike removed the material from the eye and nose openings.

Forum member John Pepera has examples of unfinished Deschlers in his collection, which he shared in this thread, starting with post #13:

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=294406

As you can see, his M1/52 (which is a factory reject due to a misstrike) had only gone through the first strike, while his 254/42 had made it through the second strike. Though unfinished, these pieces were still brought back as souvenirs by GIs.

I don't know why you find it hard to accept that a hungry German (not the GI himself) would solder a couple of the pins left over in the factory onto some of the unfinished TKs to "complete" them for the purpose of bartering or selling them to the GIs for souvenirs. "Frankenstein" daggers are well-known to have been put together from mismatched parts from variuos factory leftovers by Germans after the war for this same purpose.

By the way, soldering doesn't require a metalsmith. Any idiot can do it.

In my opinion, this TK is no "rare variant;" I believe it is no different than the other example of a post-war put-together shown in the link I pointed out earlier in this thread. That one had a much more crude pin attachment and no finish applied, but the concept was the same, a pin assembled from incomplete leftover factory pieces and rejects to meet the demands for occupation forces in the years after the fighting had ended.

[bwanek1]

IMO, it could be possible this skull is one of the first 1934 versions to appear aside from Deschler or possibly from Deschler. It appears to be die stamped from brass or silver, which is inconsistant with later skulls that were made of CupAl, Tombak and Zinc. The detail is super which also says early, again just my opinion.
Peter

Peter, as I stated, this is a well-known TK. It is commonly called the "unmarked Deschler," though it was actually not made by Deschler in my opinion. Just do a search for that term and you will find plenty of examples (with the eyes and nose openings properly opened) on this forum.

[Leroy]

Layman's question: Are the nose and eye sockets coated with a black lacquer?

[SgtB]

Well Brad, if it's not rare where are all of them?

And yes any idiot can solder, but I've never seen a postwar solder job by an unskilled solderer that looked anything like a wartime one. Try it - you will fail.

And if this skull sat unfinished until the end of the war, it sat unfinished for over 10 years, because it was made no later than 1935. Quite a stretch of the imagination . . .

[bwanek1]

Well Brad, if it's not rare where are all of them?

As I have said [twice] previously in this thread. The incorrectly named "unmarked Deschler" is a well-known style of skull. Just do the search; you will see plenty of them.

Post-war put-togethers like this one and the one in the other thread are quite rare in terms of simple numbers (as are "Frankenstein" put-together daggers in comparison to wartime originals).

And yes any idiot can solder, but I've never seen a postwar solder job by an unskilled solderer that looked anything like a wartime one. Try it - you will fail.

In fact, I do plenty of precision soldering. It doesn't take a craftsman to do a job like that. I could have done that as a kid. This is NOT a piece of jewelry!

And if this skull sat unfinished until the end of the war, it sat unfinished for over 10 years, because it was made no later than 1935. Quite a stretch of the imagination . . .

Where on earth did you come up with that date for this TK?! Do you believe you can make that declaration based upon the material alone?!

[juoneen]

Could it be italian made? I would also think if this is a punch pressed item its all done in one step. Deliberately made this way, and im guessing its some kind of possibly baked on paint, laquer possibly, as leroy inquired. Looks like if original it must have to be a rarely found version or variation. Seems to have good quality , but am unsure as to any pedigree. I dont know if you could tell if one of these if ever found in a photo would show the holes are not punched.

[SgtB]

Posting trouble, see below.