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    Very rare SS-Leibermuster-Jacket

    Hello,

    an Friend recently bought this Jacket, it was found in the early 80s in cellars of
    KZ / KL Ravensbrück.

    This type of Leibermuster was used by Division Charlemagne in 1944 and 1945,
    Division Skanderberg in 1945 and Leibstandarte Adolf Hitler in 1945.

    A modified version of this pattern, was produced by CSSR after the war.

    I had the chance to check the jacket yesterday and i'm sure it's 100% original,
    because it's like nothing i have ever seen before.
    I have three different CSSR-Leibermuster-jackets in my collection, so i can tell
    you, this is definately not a CSSR-jacket of any kind.

    The overall colour-tone of the jacket ist very different..., pattern is very differ-
    ent in details..., the style is not czech..., several details were sewn by hand...
    wich ist typical Ravensbrück-made...
    I have SS-Tarnjacken made by Texled in Ravensbrück in my collection and this
    one was made there too 100%, even the way the Buttonholes were sewn, fits
    perfectly...
    I checked the jacket with Ultraviolet and Infrared, it's totally invisible..., typical
    for authentic Leibermuster-jackets of Waffen-SS.

    The jacket is not stamped, but this is not unusual for late war production or
    prototype-series..., this pattern was first used by Charlemagne in August 44
    for prototype-testing.

    I knew that these Leibermusters were existing, because i have photos..., but
    i never dreamed about touching a real one.

    i offered my friend 5000 EUR, but he refused and told me, that he would never
    sell it, not for any money...

    Here some pictures:

    At first, the difference of this jacket and the CSSR-pattern:

    The jacket of my friend, you can clearly see the different colour and the white
    band around the black sections of the pattern, which the czech patterns never
    had.






    For easier comparison:
    This is the czech pattern, no white band..., different colours..., it glows slighty
    under influence of UV- and IR-Light, unlike the SS-pattern...!




    Division Charlemagne:






    Late Third Reich-stamp:




    Division Skanderberg:


    #2
    I don't mean to insult you...but is this a joke?

    Comment


      #3
      Its not a joke, its his REAL opinion.

      Comment


        #4
        That uniform was not manufactured before May 1945. Everything is wrong. Buttons, stitching, style... Not wartime.

        Peter

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Peter Wiking View Post
          That uniform was not manufactured before May 1945. Everything is wrong. Buttons, stitching, style... Not wartime.

          Peter
          Hi Peter,

          i do not agree with you.

          The style is very similar to other Leibermuster-summerjackets..., it's not very
          clear on the photo, but on a person or showroomdummy, it comes clearer.

          I can not say anything about the buttons..., but the stitching fits definately.

          Comment


            #6
            come on.................................

            Comment


              #7
              charlemagneXX
              The entire camoflage pattern is wrong. Also, this camoflage was not used i 1944.

              Peter

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Peppe864 View Post
                come on.................................
                At first, it was a shock for myself..., but this jacket is no fake.

                It was offered by a known german Militaria-dealer, who had it for almost 20 years in his private collection.

                He bought it himself from a coworker of "KZ-Gedenkstätte Ravensbrück"...

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Peter Wiking View Post
                  charlemagneXX
                  The entire camoflage pattern is wrong. Also, this camoflage was not used i 1944.

                  Peter
                  What you are talking about?

                  "wrong"?

                  Tell me, which pattern we see on the photos of Charlemagne and Skanderberg?

                  Comment


                    #10
                    CharlemagneXX,
                    the item you think of as being an Leiber piece is not a german wartime item. It's all wrong starting with the pattern itself.

                    The pictures you have shown show ss camouflage smocks. These have nothing to do with the Leiber-Muster items and were of much earlier issue.

                    What you have labeled "Division Charlemagne" shows SS-VT troops in france in 1940. It's an image that originates from the period book "Waffen-SS im Westen".

                    Peter is absolutely right, it's not a period piece. The good news is that you didn't buy it for 5000,-Euros.

                    Sorry

                    Fritz

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by charlemagneXX View Post

                      Tell me, which pattern we see on the photos of Charlemagne and Skanderberg?

                      Items you see on the "Charlemagne" pic (the original pic shows many more men, btw. it's NOT "charlemagne" but SS-VT in 1940) are M38 smocks in Block, Lateral and Plane tree. The "Skanderbeg" pic shows an plane tree M42, can't say if type one or two.

                      Cheers

                      Fritz

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Fritz View Post
                        CharlemagneXX,
                        the item you think of as being an Leiber piece is not a german wartime item. It's all wrong starting with the pattern itself.
                        Tell me, do you know anything about the so-called "czech-Leibermuster"...??

                        Do you know were this name is coming from??

                        The pictures you have shown show ss camouflage smocks. These have nothing to do with the Leiber-Muster items and were of much earlier issue.
                        No, not comouflage schmocks..., i have them in my collection, definately not.

                        What you have labeled "Division Charlemagne" shows SS-VT troops in france in 1940. It's an image that originates from the period book "Waffen-SS im Westen".
                        This picture was declared wrong several times..., it's from 1944.

                        Look at this picture..., May 1945, Charlemagne POWs..., also schmock-patterns
                        on the third from left?? look at the schoulder...
                        Attached Files
                        Last edited by Gary Wood; 06-09-2008, 09:55 AM.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by charlemagneXX View Post
                          At first, it was a shock for myself..., but this jacket is no fake.

                          It was offered by a known german Militaria-dealer, who had it for almost 20 years in his private collection.

                          He bought it himself from a coworker of "KZ-Gedenkstätte Ravensbrück"...
                          Are you trying to provoke someone? It does´t work, because the jacket is a piece of poopoo.

                          You can tell whatever stories you like but this item will never be original........

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Ok, enjoy your Leiber Tunic.


                            Ta-Ta

                            Fritz

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Fritz View Post
                              Items you see on the "Charlemagne" pic (the original pic shows many more men, btw. it's NOT "charlemagne" but SS-VT in 1940) are M38 smocks in Block, Lateral and Plane tree.
                              Never ever.

                              The "Skanderbeg" pic shows an plane tree M42, can't say if type one or two.
                              No, it's not even similar.

                              Comment

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