they have swindled the Obersturmfhurer

[Francesco]

And now who says to this Obersturmfhurer that its not a good tunic but a reassembled one ?!?!

[besslein]

good photo I have seen photos from EM with m40 tunics where you can very good see shadow of wh engle,I was not so uncomon,but nowadays

[bnz. 42]

100% reassembled one !

[Chris_Werner]

Serves him right. Probably purchased it from one of those German Dealers. He should have posted it for comments on the Forum before wearing it.

[John Pic]

A sad truth alot of tunics with these are discounted.I have a suspicion it was not an uncommon practice.

[NickG]

conversions

Here's a neat picture of a Wehrmacht uniform still in transition. Note that besides the breast eagle also the removal of the WH collar litzen, only ghosts of previously factory applied WH insignia are visible ! SS collar tabs not yet applied to complete the conversion ...

This would be frowned upon by modern day collectors, but obviously it was done, just like WH schirmmutzen conversions (seen often with Flemish Waffen SS volunteers!).
It appears that such alterations frequently occurred among foreign volunteer units which were raised and supplied often out side of the Reich, where they had to make do with whatever was available!

All the credit for this unique picture goes to Olli Wikberg, forum member and author of the excellant book "Meine Ehre Heist Treue" which covers Finnish foreign volunteers. I recommend this book which also shows pictures of other WH-SS tunic conversion examples, as well period pictures of Finnish army summer uniforms with SS insignia applied! Try selling one of those in modern times! Who knew?
ISBN 951-97506-2-2
Nick
PS: Olli if there is an issue with this posting let me know!

[NickG]

6 button Army conversion

Note WH (6 button) pattern tunic with (more apparent in the original picture) also a breast eagle ghost! And Army cap eagle, so cap might also be a conversion piece!! Oops sideways... Nick

[Richard P]

You guys just don't get it, and it is so clear to me. Obviously someone in the future gains access to a time travel device and takes a bunch of Heer tunics restored as SS and talks these SS personnel into a trade for their unblemished and properly tailored uniforms. They just happen to get photographed in these put together ensembles. The collector or dealer probably throws in a few thousand Deustchmarks he bought off eBay to complete the deal. You guys always try to make things so complicated.

Richard P.

[Antiquefrog]

Again: most collectors of expensive stuff want one-look items that can be sold without controversy. Even apparently period-altered items in ANY collecting field are severely discounted, from Queen Anne chairs to Art Pottery. Most well-to-do collectors and investors want only the best, and they are the driving force behind prices in the sinister SS field.

[Hofstetter]

Naturally everybody knows this type of thing happened (and still happens), would you pay 5 grand or more for a tunic that had a breast eagle though, in this day and age of counterfeiting. How easy would it be for someone skilled to put an ss tunic together from parts. As much as i'd love to have one ,in some ways i'm glad i can't afford a decent ss tunic.
Greg

[John Pic]

Verily I say unto thee that upon this very day a tunic can be assembled with no traces of a breast eagle and not one amongst thee wouldst it knoweth. John- 1,856.

[Glenn McInnes]

Verily I say unto thee that upon this very day a tunic can be assembled with no traces of a breast eagle and not one amongst thee wouldst it knoweth. John- 1,856.

I have seen some very convincing restorations that I think would fool many collectors if nothing was said. They are very good with a needle and thread these day's.



Glenn

[AndreM]

.

Very interesting! Problem is trying to judge when the piece was upgraded.

[CWP]

Trying to judge when hand-sewn insignia was applied is extremely subjective. Certainly there are people today who are able to do this work who were every bit as skilled as period tailors- and of course it was not always tailors who were doing this work, but sometimes the soldiers themselves. Original photos show countless examples of things like early insignia on late tunics and non-standard insignia application. Many thousands of uniforms were repaired and reworked at depots, replacing insignia must have been the rule rather than the exception at these depots. And there is evidence that insignia was routinely removed and replaced when uniforms were cleaned, with some sources suggesting the linings of tunics were removed for seperate cleaning. Even with factory machine applied insignia, there can be doubt. I once saw a fliegerbluse with a machine-stitched eagle that was entirely on top of the tunic wool surface; it had none of the embedded look collectors prefer to see, and looked like it was sewn on yesterday. Examination of the inside of the jacket showed that the eagle was original and had been applied before the lining was sewn in. Clearly, storage conditions over the decades play a role in how period applied insignia looks today.

[Luca Ongaro]

good photo I have seen photos from EM with m40 tunics where you can very good see shadow of wh engle,I was not so uncomon,but nowadays

Really an interesting thread Francesco
Besslein you are right you can see this on M36 too.
Luca