W-SS mantel

[Bobwirtz]

John, I'm not declaring the greatcoat as a fake. I am throwing up for discussion my doubts about the authenticity of the SS-BW stencil inside it according to the wisdom accorded me by one of my mentors and noted reference books. We know that these, as well as other stencils are sometimes put into clothing articles to enhance their authenticity. I've even seen totally authentic articles of clothing with bogus stencils put in to make them even more believable, which in the long run made it an article to stay away from.

Jotuntroll, can you give us a better straight on photo of the SS-BW stencil without a lot of flash glare?

Bob

[John Pic]

I agree with you on the stamps, I just want to warn of being overly cautious about something so little is known about. We still dont have any clear definate info as to where these stampings were used. Years ago I owned an HBT wrap from a Totenkopf NCO, it was undoubtably real and was stamped inside with SS-BW Posen and a series of numbers. It had remenants of paper inside the bottom of the large front pocket,tiny balls and shreds that look like when you accidently leave a thin piece of paper in your pocket and wash your clothes. I meticulously unraveled some shreds and found it was the remains of a clothing issue tag for the SS-Bekleidungswerk Posen. At the time I wanted to sell it so I sent it to AAG international auction in Pennsylvania. The owner called me an told me it was a total fake a real one wouldnt have those stamps or insignias sewn to it. So I asked him to send it back, he suddenly changed his tune and told me he would pay me what I had in it. Not knowing what I had at the time I agreed. I never found out what happened to it. It never appeared in his auction.

[RobertE]

I like the HBT liner, for what it's worth. Looks like a lot of SS uniform items I've seen. s/f Robert

[jotuntroll]

The autencity is importent but is here not something that I doubt. My question is mainly what do you guys thik I can sell it fore...
Thanks
Ernst

[Mark Holden]

I'll take the first stab, $15-1800(about a 1000 pounds sterling) if you just had all the insignia you are looking at $500-700 before considering the BW Greatcoat. I think the only problem you may face is that greatcoats however nice are less popular to sell and display. I am sure having said that I will be proved wrong. Just my input

regards

Mark

[Bob Hritz]

I find it difficult to believe there was only one SS-BW stamp at any manyfacturing center. I am sure that there were many made, each conforming to the proper size and lettering style. However, if you take any stamp, it will make slightly different markings depending on the type and amount of ink used, how much debris has been accumulated on the stamp, and the type of material being stamped.

I have seen a number of different and original Waffen-SS tunics marked with the SS-BW stamp. All are approximately the same, with the slight differences in width of letters and border, and clearness of the impression. None looked like identical cookie cutter markings, although all appeared to be from the same type (size and letter shape) of stamp.

The comments by other posters are also correct as bogus SS-BW stamps have been added to otherwise authentic garments, to make them 'more original'. JohnPic is also very succinct in stating that there is a cry to declare anything not owned by many 'experts' as less than perfectly original. Most of us, in our earlier collecting years, have been victim of such dubious doubts by those we looked to for guidance.

Bob Hritz

[Skullhead]

Can you show a pic of a proper SS-BW stamp? I've seen several

[Donald Abenheim]

I find it difficult to believe there was only one SS-BW stamp at any manyfacturing center. I am sure that there were many made, each conforming to the proper size and lettering style. However, if you take any stamp, it will make slightly different markings depending on the type and amount of ink used, how much debris has been accumulated on the stamp, and the type of material being stamped.

I have seen a number of different and original Waffen-SS tunics marked with the SS-BW stamp. All are approximately the same, with the slight differences in width of letters and border, and clearness of the impression. None looked like identical cookie cutter markings, although all appeared to be from the same type (size and letter shape) of stamp.

The comments by other posters are also correct as bogus SS-BW stamps have been added to otherwise authentic garments, to make them 'more original'. JohnPic is also very succinct in stating that gthere is a cry to declare anything now owned by many 'experts' as less than perfectly original. Most of us, in our earlier collecting years, have been victim of such dubious doubts by those we looked to for guidance.

Bob Hritz

Bob Hritz

Colleague Hritz makes a very important point about the betrayal by some with authority of their position of trust by dint of jealousy, envy and greed. It is the most outrageous aspect of this pursuit of ours and destroys trust. One of the signal virtues of this new medium is our ability to join forces against such a phenomenon. I always try to celebrate the acquisitions of others, without resort to the zero sum game approach that their gain is at my expense. Rather, the opposite is true. The predatory manner in which certain dealers, especially, denigrate and belittle the otherwise excellent and authentic acquisitions of others debases us all by casting into doubt all authority. My Oregonian colleague's observations are also quite important. As to the predecessor stamp to that of the Bekleidungswerke, i.e. of the Verwaltungsamt SS, there was a kind of standardized illustration of same in certain SS regulations, but one does encounter slight variations. This stamp, too, has been copied and used to mislead, as well. I re-state that the Kaienburg book on SS Wirtschaft contains a marvelous and complete description of these entities as found no where else in the 2dary literature. Sapere aude.

[Ian Hulley]

4

I can't knowledgably comment on the 'SS-BW' debate,but has anyone seen an eagle like that before ? The beak is not like any I've ever seen,almost like an attempt at a hammerhead eagle.And I've not seen size stamps like that either ?

I know it's only a personal feeling but I wouldn't be happy with this coat being 100% SS.

Ian.

[John Pic]

Now we get to the coat, I feel its a real period coat but as you point out it may have been monkeyed with. Although those hammerheads came in some odd forms.But I see nothing wrong with it basically remember its a late war item and was made in a KZ camp from recycled materials.