U-boat Leather Set

[whatthecrunchyo]

Gents,

I have been given the opportunity to own this set. What is it? Is it any good? I know nothing about KM but it sure does look cool

[whatthecrunchyo]

more

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mas

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last

[NickG]

Great find!

[phild]

It's not a set per se as this type of trouser is not the style made for issue with this jacket.....it may have been worn this way nevertheless.

The jacket is very nice and from a difficult maker to find. In my experience this maker (and maybe one other small one) are the only ones to have these jackets show up with KM property stamps......I've seen only a couple of 3 in 30 years.

These unforms were worn by some KM personnel and may have been designed for the midget sub personnel, I think that they all were made late war....not before 43 and maybe not until 44.

There is also some reported use by PZ personnel of this style uniform and some photos of PZ personnel wearing them.

[NickG]

It appears to be dated 5 Feb, 1942...not mid-late war...
Couldn't a S-Boot (e-boat) crew member have worn these on deck?

The midget sub theory is interesting and the style (cut) makes sense for cramped working conditions but the date appears to be too early
for that (a late war KM force)...

This wrapper is not necessarly a late war design as similar sets were issued early on to NSKK personnel too (of course not with the eagle M)
as protective clothing for I assume motorcycle use!

Here's another thread on these!
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...eather+wrapper





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[whatthecrunchyo]

Nice deduction on the date Nick. I couldn't exactly tell what it was. What would have been the other common uniform pieces worn in conjunction with this leather set? I am asking so I can keep out an eye for items for my future display

[48RMC]

very nice set there are some period pics from sub midget crews hows wearing these jackets by the way nice km stamp

[phild]

It appears to be dated 5 Feb, 1942...not mid-late war...
Couldn't a S-Boot (e-boat) crew member have worn these on deck?

The midget sub theory is interesting and the style (cut) makes sense for cramped working conditions but the date appears to be too early
for that (a late war KM force)...

This wrapper is not necessarly a late war design as similar sets were issued early on to NSKK personnel too (of course not with the eagle M)
as protective clothing for I assume motorcycle use!

.

Nick, the trousers are dated 1942...BUT these have nothing to do with the date of introduction or production of the wrap or the wrap sets.... so I can say that everyone that I have seen dated has been 44....with maybe one or two dated 43...I can not quite recall.

As for NSKK use...either early or late...I can say that there is not one shred of evidence ever produced to show this...either in primary source documentation of photos... I ma very aware of this legend got introduced back in the 80s...it was flawed then as now IMO. The photos of NSKK motorcycle riders wearing leather are clearly NOT wearing these type sets....there is no question for me of this.

There are a couple of things that I know about these sets....that is beyond any doubt for me:

1. Photos (several to near a dozen) exist of these wraps being worn very late war by KM personnel (mainly officers) some of which on standing on or near various types of U-Boats and in ones case at least an E-Boat. Along with this photo evidence is the fact that some of these sets are period KM marked....but only a small % of those that are found now.

2. Photos (very few) exist of these exact sets being worn by PZ personnel specifically HG Div. There is also some very compelling evidence for me that some of these were captured from both SS and Heer PZ units.

[phild]

I wanted to clarify some things in my last post on these sets.

1. The trousers posted (and dated 1942) are made for the standard KM leather "crew" uniform, not these wrap sets. The trousers made with these wraps had many differences from the set posted such as button flap pockets, belt loops (came with a belt and suspenders) no rear half belt, higher cut waist, not lined and many other different details. I mention this only to say that the date stamped on the posted trousers have no bearing on the date that the wrap was made.

2. I realize that these wraps were posted in a reference book circa late early 90s (?) on the NSKK (J. Angola) and there was a period photo or two in the book as well of motorcycle personnel wearing leather riding sets......the connection made in the book was that THESE sets were in fact NSKK.....and those photos were essentially the evidence presented for this conclusion.

The problem is the sets in the period photos published in that book are not in any way these same sets...not even very close. They are in fact civilian motorcycle leather set from the 1930s......they show many differences with these sets.

These sets had nothing to do with the NSKK. The NSKK was all but defunct by the time these sets were developed. Not a RM would have been spent on NSKK uniform developement in 43-45!