U Boat ALPACCA Goblet

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What are your opinions of this Crew XII/39 ALPACCA Goblet?

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goblet

goblet

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goblet 3

goblet3

[Eric JB]

With that German Eagle and the M on it, it seems a bit overdone to me.

yours friendly

Eric-Jan

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Goblet

First of all I am not selling this item.
It has be shown to me. With option to purchase only one gobelet,seller is keeping 3. Needs money.

These are items I am extremely weary of. Many engraved items are coming of of Ukraine/Latvia.

The concept to take household items in plated silver and decorate them. Today, etchings are done mechanically but give a deep, impersonal cut that can lack in fluidity. It seems that in such a proceeding, the machine cannot adjust for curvature of the piece, as could a human hand, moderating the impression to the natural fluidity of the shape of the item. Furthermore, one can feel the ridges of the etchings with one's finger. Take out you grandmother's English plated silver and you will feel no ridges. You will notice oxidation in the cut lines.

This having been said, I have magnified this piece to see that the etching is hand made. The groove marks under magnification show imperfections that a machine would not make.

In person the M and eagle do not look so ostentatious as in the picture. That is not my area of concern.

Furthermore the goblet was part of a set of 6? ( likely) of which the owner has 4 ( I have seen).

If done by hand, this seems to represent a substantial amount of work...something to consider. That's 8 handmade etchings for 4 cups. At today's rate.....a lot of work hadmade.

The ALPACCA brand name is consistant with period mark of the company.

Any opinions?

[Eric JB]

F.B.

I only replied to your question :

"What are your opinions of this Crew XII/39 ALPACCA Goblet?"

Seems to me that you already did have all the answers yourself !

Know that : "At today's rate.....a lot of work handmade." .......which cost nearly nothing in the "Ukraine/Latvia" ......India or Pakistan etc.

Such items are for sale on Ebay, Epier and other auction sites.

yours friendly

Eric-Jan

[Militaria-Berlin]

1st question, whats the "M" meant to stand for? Marine?
well that would be wrong for a start, it should be KM for Kriegsmarine.

2nd, Alpacca is not a company name. Its the name of the material used:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpaca_silver

and its rather strange to see the double "C" in Alpaca on a German item. generally they used a "K" as in Alpaka (although its not impossible)

In your place, I´d avoid. unless you find some photos of the guys using it or similar.


MB

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Goblets

Eric
Many thanks for your input! I'm not pretending to have all the answers. Simply playing devils advocate
and trying to weigh the arguments for and against such a piece.

I think you and I agree that such a piece is highly doubtful, dangerous waters. That is why I collect equipment and uniforms.

Thanks again and please know that my comments were in no way meant to be antagonistic. But I know what you mean, I see it sometimes on the forum where you can just feel the steam coming off of the treads especially when you tell someone their stuff is fake.
Best

[FESTUNGBREST]

Hallo MB
I am familiar with the composition of Alpaca, Alpacca.

Here are two points for you.

1.On this link it is spelled with two CC's:
www.925-1000.com/silverglossary.html

2.Why is it that on my Marine items are not stamped KM as you say they should? Sorry but that theory doesn't apply. See pics.

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Marine

Loefel is auch mit M gestemplet.

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alpacca,alpaca,alpaka

Alpacca silver stamps spelled ALPACCA:www.silvercollection.it/ASCASBERNDORF.html

[Eric JB]

Eric
Many thanks for your input! I'm not pretending to have all the answers. Simply playing devils advocate
and trying to weigh the arguments for and against such a piece.

I think you and I agree that such a piece is highly doubtful, dangerous waters. That is why I collect equipment and uniforms.

Thanks again and please know that my comments were in no way meant to be antagonistic. But I know what you mean, I see it sometimes on the forum where you can just feel the steam coming off of the treads especially when you tell someone their stuff is fake.
Best

F.B.

All clear, no problems at all, I understand what you mean.

If something was marked by the Kriegsmarine, it was most often marked with the M or with an Eagle and the M under it.

yours friendly

Eric-Jan

[WWIIBuff]

I know this thread is a couple of months old, but I only saw it now. I just had to mention what I saw when I went to a local gun show last weekend. There were two ladies there with a table full of supposed 3rd reich items they were selling.

The table was full of antique items like straight razors for shaving, snuff boxes, jewelry boxes, metal handled hair brushes, etc. There were probably a hundred different items or more, and all of them were emblazened with the swastika.

These items we all real antiques, but it was hard for me to keep myself from asking if they engraved their swastika's locally or not.

And not that I'm implying anything about one particular part of this world, but I believe both women had Russian or similar accents.

[Kondor]

WW2 Buff,

Keep in mind that the swastika was used as a symbol of good luck prior to Adolf taking it over and abusing it. My grandmother had a gold swastika broach that she wore back in the 1890's. I have a deck of playing cards adorned with clover leafs, horse shoes and swastika's that were printed in 1910.

[WWIIBuff]

I was thinking about that Kondor, and some of those items may have been from that era, but they were definately being sold as 3rd Reich items at the gun show.