Kriegsmarine/Reichsmarine/Imperial/Bundesmarine Cap Tallies

[Norm F]

need a good closeup of Jody's

Jody,

I do not think we need other images based on these comparisons, the tally lengths, and overall appearance of both tallies.

It shows how dangerous your tally is compared to the other tally if, and it is a big IF, the tally was cut down to the name only.

You could still tell by the ribbon material and stiffness I think, however, it would be hard for most to tell on an ebay auction.

For nothing else, your tally is worth keeping as it is such a good copy.

John

This has been really educational.
I'd like to see a really good sharp closeup of Jody's since it is the only one with known provenance to establish the look of these excellent copies.
As far as the side by side (or top by bottom!) comparison between Jody's and Peter's goes, allowing for differences in lighting, photo/scan technique these could be identical production pieces -- I guess that "in hand" experience for the feel and the "stretchiness" is crucial in this case.
Best regards,
---Norm

[John R.]

This has been really educational.
I'd like to see a really good sharp closeup of Jody's since it is the only one with known provenance to establish the look of these excellent copies.
As far as the side by side (or top by bottom!) comparison between Jody's and Peter's goes, allowing for differences in lighting, photo/scan technique these could be identical production pieces -- I guess that "in hand" experience for the feel and the "stretchiness" is crucial in this case.
Best regards,
---Norm

Post 10 is a Belfast tally. John

[Jody]

Scharnhorst Tally

Hi John,
Do you want me to send the tally to you (for a closer look)? I also have the HMS Belfast tally that was purchased at the same time. Do you want me to post scans of this fake tally?

BTW, the material of the fake Scharnhorst tally is more stiff when compared to a standard tally.

Jody

[John R.]

Hi John,
Do you want me to send the tally to you (for a closer look)? I also have the HMS Belfast tally that was purchased at the same time. Do you want me to post scans of this fake tally?

BTW, the material of the fake Scharnhorst tally is more stiff when compared to a standard tally.

Jody

Hi Jody,

I will look at it when I see you next in Arizona. It would be nice to post a picture of the entire Scharnhorst tally laid out in a line to look at the lengths.

Yes, an image of the Belfast tally would be helpful since it should reflect the same threads and tally material. Please post it here.

John

[Jody]

H.M.S. Belfast

Hello,
As promised here is a tally for the H.M.S. Belfast which was purchased at the same time as the Scharnhorst tally aboard the H.M.S. Belfast (gift shop) in 1999.

Regards,
Jody

Obverse:

[Jody]

H.M.S. Belfast

Reverse of tally:

[Jody]

H.M.S. Belfast

Here is the short end of the tally (cut in the same manner as the Scharnhorst tally).

I hope this stuff is of some use or interest.

Regards,
Jody

[JustinG]

I find it very interesting and very informative. Thank you Jody for posting these examples. You saved me a small fortune because, I would have probably fallen victim to the Scharnhorst tally you posted earlier.
Interesting that the Belfast's tally posted reverse has such a staggered threading detail. Don't see that on the Scharnhorst example?
Regards and a big thanks,
JustinG

[Norm F]

very helpful

Here is the short end of the tally (cut in the same manner as the Scharnhorst tally).

I hope this stuff is of some use or interest.

Regards,
Jody

Very interesting. Thanks for posting Jody. That latest picture of the short end of the Belfast shows more clearly the ribbed or corrugated texture to the black ribbon to which John alluded earlier which may be a good clue in distinguishing from an original.
Interesting that such a modern loom in 1999 would produce a stitch pattern on the reverse of your Belfast gift shop Scharnhorst talley shown earlier so scarily alike to the original...worrisome for the future.
Best regards,
---Norm

[John R.]

No, not a worry at all. This was an official production run and they just used the same machines as they were using for the RN. As far as I know, the Scharnhorst tally, the most dangerous of all tallies to purchase in any form of thread besides gold wire, is no longer sold in HMS Belfast.

No matter what, the HMS Belfast fake is not good enough for a collector that has read this thread and can therefore avoid that particular example.

At this point, we have 340 posts and that is enough I think for one thread. As stated at the beginning, the purpose of the thread was to try to help collectors determine if a tally was period or not as they tried to determine authenticity of a particular piece.

This can be quite daunting at times, especially since the information concerning tallies was mainly concentrated in Germany among the many German collectors there and the German language books that have been identified in this thread. Naturally, we are waiting for the KM book to be published by Markus and Bernd at some point in the future which will be quite a help.

For collectors whom wish to post tallies in their collections or ask questions about those tallies, you should post on this forum.

This thread is closed and I hope the objective was served. The German Navy tally collecting world has been alive and well for probably one hundred or more years, far predating the TR era but as I mentioned, the collectors were in mainly in Germany--it is thanks to their help that this thread was possible for non-German collectors who might like to pursue this aspect of militaria.

Thanks to all.

John

[R.R.]

SMS Gneisenau Cap Tally

Hi,

Imperial cap tallies are not exactly my target, but it was a very important ship with some historic significance. Tally has two old repairs done sometimes ago.











Regards,

Ricardo

[Frank K]

The same here. Maybe when I have all the KM tallies I'll turn Imperial, who knows.

Anyway, thanks for showing Ricardo!

[JustinG]

I have found that if you have a wonderful photo postcard showing the ship, it goes so much further with others and builds an appreciation especially those who have no idea what a tally/ muetzenband represents.
Would make a nice framed display.
You could also look and see if you can track down the red thread version as well?

Best regards,
JustinG

[Trance_Eyes]

Hi Guys, Im not an imperial fan either but if someone else collects them and posts them with such wonderful pictures its still very enjoyable

Best regards,
JustinC

[R.R.]

Hi Guys, Im not an imperial fan either but if someone else collects them and posts them with such wonderful pictures its still very enjoyable

Best regards,
JustinC

I agree Justin, I see very few imperial tallies here. There is no one collecting imperial tallies? Why?

My main preference is the KM periode, but I'd like too to see some imperials ones with nice postcard pictures.

If it's possible may be I'll purchase some others from imperial fighting ships in the future.


Now only complementing the topic informations: During my search about SMS Gneisenau images, I found this very interesting page (link below the image) with a great number of pictures from the periode the ship was based at Tsingtau. I observed too how much the Orient looked much more exotic and mysterious during the earlies XX Century years than in the actual globalized world. There are too some nice crew pictures like the one I posted with the tally.



http://www.thefrankes.com/wp/?page_id=1596

Best Regards,

Ricardo