"M45" helmets

[Perry Floyd]

The matt color was standard after 1940. The texture and shade varied among the different makers and each makers shade varied to the time period.

[Frentebro]

This was totally matt & not the semi-matt typically seen on the "slate gray" finishes.

[Perry Floyd]

They were matt not semi matt(or semi gloss). The late war slate gray was matt as well.

[Brian Ice]

Paint

Although not official WWII german designations, the paint catalog described in Goodapple (Vol II) is very helpful for collectors to distinguish the different paints used. Some of the basics:

"parade finish light green" for early army, navy, SS, etc..
"parade finish blue/gray" for early luftwaffe
"rough texture green/gray" for wartime army, navy, SS, etc..
"rough texture blue/gray" for wartime luftwaffe
"rough texture SS gray" for mid war army, navy, SS, etc..

On the M45A helmet (w/M31 liner) there appears to be "rough texture dark green"
On the M45B helmet (w/M44 liner) there appears to be "VERY rough texture dark green"

On the qvL64 helm (M45-B) there appears to be "VERY rough texture medium gray"

[Perry Floyd]

Although at the time a good overview it's a little more than what is quoted in German helmets Vol.II concerning paint color. Shades varied alot and a simple walk through a show looking at original Heer helmets will show 15 different shades or better. By maker, then individual makers varied depending the era, then regulations requesting the color change.

[Blindpew]

Another of Brians. qvl64

[Jan B]

Brian, is it possible to post some additional pictures of the insides of your examples?

Thanks in advance

Cheers

Jan

[Blindpew]

Inside shots

These are the inside photos of 2 of Brians ventless helmets.

[Blindpew]

2nd of two photos.

[Perry Floyd]

There's nothing in the interior of these helmets I like.

[Brian Ice]

M45/M42 comparison

The M45-B and the M42 are actually very different.

M42: shell: vented paint: green/gray (army) texture: rough
liner: M31 chinstrap: sewn-on buckle

M45-B: shell: ventless paint: dark green (army) texture: very rough
liner: M44 chinstrap: some with buckle riveted on

The two liners are quite different as well:

M31: ring: double band construction liner brads: aluminum
split rivets: standard length legs tie string: complex weave
slotted washers: used leather reinforcers: used

M44: ring: single band w/3 "V" clips liner brads: steel
split rivets: long legs tie string: simple "rope" style weave
slotted washers: omitted due to slots in "V" clips.
leather reinforcers: sometimes omitted

[Brian Ice]

M45 debate

For those of us new to the M45 debate, there is no wartime documentation to support this model's authenticity. However, a lack of docmentation does NOT necessarily mean that the model is not genuine. There are those on both sides of this debate who are firmly entrenched, and many more who are not sure, but those who can find hard evidence to support their viewpoint will be those who can truly shed some light on this mystery. Those of us who may be "purists" will insist on documentation before they will believe. Others are willing to carefully examine what evidence is available to either make a decision, or conclude that more evidence is needed.

[Brian Ice]

M45: what is it?

In researching this model i have come across different opinions as to it's origin:
1. it is of WWII manufacture, but it is a "factory reject", meaning the vents were mistakenly omitted.
2. it is a post war produced helmet.
3. it is a forgery, as evidenced by the many repaints/reworks seen.
4. it is a legitimate model of WWII manufacture, vent holes omitted as a time/labor saving measure very late in the war to speed helmet production.

1. We know that quality control "Q.C." personell were ferreting out bad shells which failed ballistic "visual" inspection. Helmets that exibited imperfections in the steel were marked with stamped "beads" to ensure they were not issued to combat troops (e.g. luftschutz beaded M35/M40/M42). It seems it would have been quite obvious to Q.C. that a helmet was missing vent holes. It then would have been returned to the "vent stamping machine". If helmets were slipping out of the factory w/out vents on a somewhat regular basis, one would expect to see M35/M40 ventless helmets. But, to my knowledge, only the rough edge helmet has been found ventless at this time.

2. According to people in the know, the german rough edge helmet (M42) was not produced post war. WWII shells were re-worked by west germany by welding a screw on the inside top of the bowl to attach a new liner system. The 3 former liner retaining holes were welded shut, as they were not needed, to give the helmet a cleaner look. Vent holes were not removed as they served a purpose. Later a ventless rolled edge helmet was produced, along with a vented rolled edge helmet.

3. If the M45 ventless was the last model of german combat helmet produced in WWII, then at war's end, at the time of a helmet factory's capture, the model found in various states of completion would have been M45. These unfinished M45's could have made their way into the collecting world as "completed" repainted/reworked helmets. Also, I have seen M42's with welded vent holes. These can have original liners installed with repro hardware. These are of course typical repaints. Some have somewhat poor weld jobs that make it possible to spot the former vent hole under the paint. I have not seen these forgeries with 1945 dated M31 liners or M44 liners which are very difficult to obtain. In my opinion, this is the greatest argument against the M45.

4. This argument makes sense from a late war german perspective. Ideas to increase efficiency would have been highly valued. The vent hole is an unnecesary feature as evidenced by the fact that most allied helmets do not have them. Even though there is no docmentation for the ventless shell or the M45 designation, the liners (M31, M44) do have wartime documentation. The fact that the M45 helmets in my collection possess a 1945 dated M31 liner and the very rare M44 liners, i believe lend credence to this model's authenticity. (very rare liners are not normally found in faked helmets)

So then, why would a forger spend a great deal of time and effort, obtain extremely rare liners, (obtain the rare hardware to install the liners-e.g. long legged rivets) obtain/apply high quality factory textured paint, do, in essence almost the impossible, to produce the M45, a helmet model that "does not exist". Correct me if i'm wrong, but i thought that "forgery" was the criminal reproduction of something of value that already exists?

[Frentebro]

Brian, not to disagree with you, just to note that there are fantasies as well as forgeries.

I'm unaware that the BRD reworked TR helms to the M-35/53 (single liner bolt) configuration. That would have been a major job. Marzetti (32.124) does show an M-35/42 reworked with Schuberth liner, a conversion which involved less of an effort.

It seems that many TR helms were reissued by the BRD with just a new paint job, for CD/emergency services.

[Perry Floyd]

First I don't believe your liners to be rare. They both are post war builds in my opinion including the leather. The M31 you refer too doesn't even look like a correct M31. The M44 was still being tested near wars end, it was not dramaticly different than the M31 and would take the same leather that a M31 would take. Notice how yours(both) is ill fitting and non-textbook of original M31 leather. It has more in common with the post war amateurish made liners.
If you believe in these there's nothing wrong with that, its what you like so seek them out for your collection, but you have to know once they leave your world they are thought of much differently.