Panzer field cap

[MVV]

Any comments on this early? (1936?) dated Pz cap with yellow soutache ?

Sorry for the scanned pictures, but hope will do...

Thanks - Marc

[Perry Floyd]

I owned one of these a long time ago so I am out of my area here but what I do have a question on is the soutache, it's uneven and makes me wonder is it tucked through at the bottom?

[MVV]

Pz cap

It was not easy to scan this 'properly' .. hope this is what you mean .

m.

[Perry Floyd]

Yes that's it..Besides that I would have to leave the judgement to someone more qualified in this area..

[SgtB]

What year were these introduced? Wasn't the beret still in
use well into 1940?

[Perry Floyd]

It's a model34 Feldmutz so this design was around but I'm not sure when the transition from the beret and M34 started..
Another concern I have is why it has NOVEMBER?? Then a date..
It would have to be unissued because the tag is not stained, so why would it then be named and dated? The inside tag troubles me....

[GJR100]

As far as I know, the soutache on these early caps were only fastened on three points; the bottom and on the top part in the middle. This one seems to be maschine applied ... Does the stitching go through the lining ?
Could you post a close-up of the inside of the airvent ?

Just my opinion,

Bart

[MVV]

Pz/Pi

The soutache of the Pz cap is machine stitched , not trough the lining .. only trough the 'flap' as well is the national device . As far as my opinion is that ok , see for comparision a early 1938 dated Pionier cap ( regular troop mdl !!) .. here also the same machinal stitched black soutache & nat. device.

The Pz cap however is a privatly purchase , and is (again IMHO) conform on other know examples. ( Perry : the cap is mint and unworn , so I think it will be fair that the tag is not stained)
The tag is also machinal sewed in the cap with the same tread as the cap is assembled.
My major confusion is : I allways thought that black Pz caps (Ml 34) only came in production in late 1939 ?? , so why a black cap in 1936 ....or is there a other regulation for officer and NCO that time incomparision to troop.


Thanks - Marc

[Perry Floyd]

A named, unworn example is quite possible but something you have to consider. The way the date is still troubles me...

[Adrian Stevenson]

Hi Marc, I would be very wary of this cap. The date worries me too and Brian is correct about the introduction date. These caps in black were not introduced until the 27th March 1940. The order was given under "Allgemeine Heers - Mitteilung 1940, Nr. 429". Hence you see photos from the Polish and French campaigns of Panzer troopers wearing, against regulations, the field grey M34 cap in preference to the unpopular Panzer beret.
The cap itself looks to me like a Janke product going by the grade of soft wool used in it's construction.
Hope this helps you?
Cheers, Ade.

[SgtB]

Yes it's an M-34 style hat...

But the M-34 was field-gray until the beret was replaced,
which I thought was well into the French occupation.Is there
any photo evidence of a black panzer sidecap in wear before,
say,1939?

I was suspect of the tag right away. Is it possible that it has
been carefully hand stitched to resemble machine-sewing?
I've seen this done before.

Some definitely had black interiors, but is it possible that this
cap was field-gray originally and then dyed?

I have to be careful of my wording here, because I'm not
certain that this cap is bad, just suspicious.

[SgtB]

Thanks Ade!

That's what I thought!

We must've been typing at the same time!

[SgtB]

How about the grommets?

While we're on the subject, the air grommets bother me too.

The reason I say this is that I had a DAK M-41 many years ago
that I was sure was right. But it had grommets exactly like these,
and a much older, wiser collector swore up and down that they
were bad. Any answers?

[MVV]

Pz

Thanks Brian , Ade &.

Brian the tag is definitive machine sewned.

Tag should stay a mystery then ...

Marc

[Jean-Loup]

I dont know a thing about these, but would like to bring an idea. Does this tag have anything to do with the cap, I mean the companie name and stuff. Is it possible the soldier who owned this cap had a bunch of name tags from when he was in bording school, or when he was doing his RAD service or whatever, and put one on his cap when it was issued to him, witch would explain the strange date.

JL