Battle of the buldge camo?

[Perry Floyd]

Yes, those posted are commonly refered to as S. Italian front camo's. But like talked about, isn't for certain. It's when tan/brown is the dominate color with little green..

[Ty Smith]

Nice looking helmets guys. Love to have one like that.

[SgtB]

Thanks, Ben

That's the closest so far, but I've always considered the type
like yours a tri-color. It's a very fine line...and just an opinion.

I had a M-35 DD first pattern Luft like yours two years ago.
A little rougher. Sold it. Stupid.

I'm always surprised (not really) when I see original footage
at Normandy or the Ardennes, just how few of the helmets are camo'd. I realize these are just little snippets of a much larger
picture, but I believe it was an extremely rare practice.I know
mine would've been.

[Ben]

Brian,

the helmet is actually only a two tone (orangy tan - red/brown).
Intersting thing is that the helmet was lost in Holland in Sept. 1944. It is a single decal helmet. My personal take on this is that on the Northwest European front almost any camo type is possible. They all seem to have been worn here at some stage.

The example I always like best for non- textbook are what appears to be the two tone camo helmets that were used by the 12th. SS in Normandy.

Attached some Jpeg's of what I personally consider the "Normandy" camo style although these were both found in the Netherlands too. M35 DD LW and SD M38 FJ

Cheers,

Ben

[Ben]

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[Ben]

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[Ty Smith]

Great looking lids.
This was supposedly a Market Garden pickup from a 101st solider. Has a camo that I would expect would be an autumn scheme. Hard to know for sure..

[Jean-Loup]

Brian, I dont agree with you about the not many camo helmets. On many pictures, it is possible to see several chicken wires, or camos at a time, without speaking of the winter camos, desert camos, and camo covers and rubber bands, wich were ubiquitous in the concerned areas. It is true thow that it is quite rare to see two or three tones helmets in pictures.
I suspect that vets had a tendency to pick up nice helmets with nice decals, and not helmets with weird paint or junky wire on them, witch would explaine why camos are vary rare now. Also, almost all the white and yellow camos ended up in Russia or north Africa were they were probably destroyed on a larger scale than in western Europe.
JL

[Ty Smith]

I agree Jean, - Love that para Ben.

[Willi Z.]

Some great camos!!!

On the Normandy camo issue, I know the use of that is worn out. And, I know we have had this discussion in the past. I think in most cases there is no way to know for sure.......the camo variations are endless...3-color, 2-color.

As Andy stated, and we have demonstrated in the past...and I am sure Ben will agree. We can directly trace many FJ camo helmets with the tan and green spray, with saw dust rubbed into the paint, as having been picked up in Normandy. Most of these have, the ones that could be, have been traced to FJR6. Specifically I./FJR6, as this unit was almost totally wiped out by elements of the 101st Airborne. Honestly, these camos are the most common camo pattern on an FJ helmet that can be encountered, and I must have seen a solid 45 of these by now. I once saw a 101st veteran bring in 6 of these...we could go on and on. Mine (pictured below) came back from the St Lo area, by a vet of the 2nd ID, and is named to an Oberfeldwebel. These camos are the only ones I would ever pin down by theater. We are guessing with Italian vs North Africa, etc. Even when we know where it was picked up, it is unlikely to encounter a bunch in the same exact paint scheme. A 3-color camo could have come from Normandy, Russia, Holland and Germany '45. Those colors where the standard armor colors from '43 on. Anyhow...preaching to the choir in most cases.

Willi

[Jean-Loup]

Willy, it sounds like your I./FJR6 had their helmets chain camouflaged as a unit; probably like the US 117th para regiment before their jump in the south of France on 15 august 44. I would think most helmets with spray paint used were camoed 'en masse', since paintguns were probably dificulte to encounter.

JL

[Willi Z.]

I agree JL. Many helmets were camoed on the Kompanie level during training. Many units, FJ and Heer, were in Normandy months before the invasion and knew the invasion was coming at some point. They had plenty of time to camo helmets on an "organized" basis, and had access to better camo paints and spray equipment, alllowing for more consistency in camo.

Willi

[Jean-Loup]

Yes, totaly agreed. I think almost all the spraypaint camoes come from the western front. I dont remember seing any in the east. Lack of time and equipement to do that I would say.
JL

[Jean-Loup]

Hey, Willy, have you ever interviewed german veterans about how and when they camoed theyr helmets???

[nick]

Hi Guys

This is getting very interesting.
What about this one?