Could this be a KM decal?

[Perry Floyd]

I agree, lets hear some other helmet collectors opinions..

[Perry Floyd]

Billy, you mention it's a DD, post the National shield to see how much the white has toned...that will give you a idea the age toning that has taken place..

[william r match]

Daylight has beat me on this occassion, or lack of it to be more precise.

Old snap attached.

Billy

[william r match]

Guys,

To put the record straight, obvious detail in this decal is present and exclusive to early KM decals. Not to see this displays a lack of knowledge of the subject.

I offered a number of occassions for the moderator of this forum to correct his assessment but was only met with further vagueness, inuendo and total lack of clarity on this issue. Decal identification is not in question here, lack of knowledge is!

My initial post was an effort to assist a fellow collector who has experienced dificulty on what is a tricky area for many. However the course of the thread has revealed much more.

Regards,

Billy

[Rich G]

I'd just like to add that I have held Billy's helmet in my hands as he was kind enough to show it to me.

I see the problems associated with distinguishing between a KM decal and a toned Heer decal as I posted a similar thread myself only recently.

Back to Billy's helmet... the colour is without a doubt a deep gold, and not toned silver, that has superb depth and colour with a metallic glint that I have not seen in a heer decal.

The decal also has that 3 dimentional structure that I've read about in the reference books, that also identifies a Heer from a KM decal.

I know how difficult to give opinions based on photos... we do it all the time over in the badges and Ek forums. I feel in this case the photo's are not telling the whole picture.

To recap, having held this very helmet in my hands and compared it to heer decals (included quite toned ones) there is no doubt in my mind (and yes, I'm no expert on helmets) that it is KM. When I saw this helmet I fully understood what others had meant by... when you've seen a KM you'll never mistake it from a heer.

Rich

[Perry Floyd]

"I offered a number of occassions for the moderator of this forum to correct his assessment but was only met with further vagueness, inuendo and total lack of clarity on this issue. Decal identification is not in question here, lack of knowledge is!"


Vagueness? What are you talking about? Evidently it's your knowledge in question. Never have I needed to ask so many people is this a KM helmet. It is clear you have, as you didn't know yourself. Your link of the posts show that. Keep showing it around to increase your knowledge level Billy. Your just going on what people have told you, you didn't know yourself...get some more advice and come back and spout off more..


"To put the record straight, obvious detail in this decal is present and exclusive to early KM decals"

Ok, Billy give us this obvious detail so lacking in early Heer decals. If you need to go ask someone then come back I would fully understand.


Billy if you can't take it without
then don't post it..

[william r match]

Mr Floyd,

I rest my case!

Be seeing you guys!

Regards,

Billy

[Perry Floyd]

That was one hellva case...

[WalterB]

Billy what is your malfunciton? A mere few hours passed between the time you posted your pictures and the time you posted an insulting message about the moderator's "vagueness, inuendo and total lack of clarity" for not replying to your post. You can't get immediate comments to your posts, this forum is not designed to work that way. Most people tune in here every now and then (once, maybe twice a day) and you can't expect (or, in your case, DEMAND "live one-on-one" chat). It doesn't work that way. You have a nice helmet, but your initial picture was poor in quality and it was hard to determine if it was an aged Heer or KM.

[Ty Smith]

Hi Billy,
I understand your frustration. We all have had helmets shot down by other collectors. Fact is, it may not be as obvious as other KM decals. It's your helmet and it's in your collection, If you think it's right than who cares what someone else says. This hobby is nothing more than opinions anyway. I think you have enough top collectors agreeing with you on this one. Perry is entitled to his opinion. That's really what this forum and others is about. Let me know if you want to sell that helmet?

Can anyone educate me on the differences between a KM and Heer other than the gold color? I must admit that's a new one on me?

-Ty

[Calvin Hall]

Guys, let's get back on message here.

In my mind, I feel that the one posted by Billy is an obvious KM decal. I'm not an 'expert', but that's my opinion.

That being said, we need to understand the numerous pitfalls involved in examining digital photography for opinion. What we see on our monitors is influenced by a variety of factors. The lighting, camera, etc. used by the photographer are a large part of this. Look at photos taken outdoors vs. indoors, for instance.

Also, the quality of the monitor and its setting for contrast/brightness/color/warmth, etc. influence what we see. Look at the same photography on two different monitors and see what I mean. I use a monitor at work and another at home. Everything looks a little bit different on the two.

Calvin

[Rich G]

In my quest to learn more about helmets and decals, from what I understand about identifying KM decals, other than the colour, is that a slighly raised ridge can be found along the top of the eagles wing. This is evident on the all the pics posted by Billy (bar one) and also evident on the decal posted by Perry. Is this no longer a sure rule for identification???

Rich

[Calvin Hall]

Rich,

It is my understanding that what you say about the ridge is correct. The ridge is visible just above the wings in Billy's second photo.

However, not all original KM decals exhibit this ridge.

Calvin

[Perry Floyd]

It was my intention to have people post more decals and dicuss why or why not a KM decal. Not to have someone pitch a fit and come back with rude comments because some objections to what has been told to him previously..
The ridge may or may not be found on original KM decals, more often found than not. It's also been found on Heer decals as well but very uncommon..
How about this one, do you detect a ridge? See one guys?

[Perry Floyd]

How about this one? See the ridge??
Or is it even a KM decal?? Maybe the other one is not a KM??