Feldendamerie Waffenrock insignia set

[Darth2a]

Finally got my hands on some FG cloth. Obviously not issued but still looks good IMO. Thoughts appreciated as always!

[pauke]

A word of caution regarding Feldgendarmerie insignia-- up until the beginning of the war orange was the color of recruiters and IMO most all Waffenrock insignia are likely from this period. Finding Fg shoulder straps meant for the field uniform is in my experience difficult and certainly some recruiter orange insignia were used by Fg units. Finding slip-on straps are more likely to be considered Fg insignia, and if you can find any in feldgrau then you really have something. The same goes for visor hats. Who can say if a pre-war hat was not used later by Feldgendarmerie, but finding one made of later war cloth is uncommon. This is only my observation and others will likely chime in with different views. You can count on tropical orange-piped straps being Fg. Best of luck collecting!

[Darth2a]

A word of caution regarding Feldgendarmerie insignia-- up until the beginning of the war orange was the color of recruiters and IMO most all Waffenrock insignia are likely from this period. Finding Fg shoulder straps meant for the field uniform is in my experience difficult and certainly some recruiter orange insignia were used by Fg units. Finding slip-on straps are more likely to be considered Fg insignia, and if you can find any in feldgrau then you really have something. The same goes for visor hats. Who can say if a pre-war hat was not used later by Feldgendarmerie, but finding one made of later war cloth is uncommon. This is only my observation and others will likely chime in with different views. You can count on tropical orange-piped straps being Fg. Best of luck collecting!

This information is most appreciated!

[Mike Swan]

Pauke is spot on with his assessment, IMHO.

However, I seem to recall seeing a photo on the WAF of a few personnel wearing waffenrocks displaying the gendarmerie arm eagle. I wish I could be more specific but it was a long time ago.

Mike

[galizien41]

Feldgrau orange is tough, I agree. And in June 1944 the order was given for Ordnance to wear orange as well. These were mostly high level NCO's and Officers. Crossed cannons cyphers. Engineers with the cogwheel cypher wore orange until around 43. So theoretically one could find feldgrau straps and boards in orange with these two devices as well.

[Lenny W]

Post war ddr tresse on boards ?

[Schulterklappen]

Tresse

Post war ddr tresse on boards ?

I agree it looks odd.

[Darth2a]

Post war ddr tresse on boards ?

Now that you mention it...

Image for comparison with other Waffenrock boards I own.

[Nydigger1]

This pair was originally mine. I welcome any additional discussion on this set. As we all know this hobby is a daily learning experience. Here are my 2 cents:

The question of the tress being post war, I must disagree disagree. Private purchase pieces were not held to the same standards as officially made pieces. Ive had and had seen enough boards over the years to know that theres a wide amount of room for variation including similar examples. That being said I have seen plenty of DDR pieces w/ WW2 correct tress as well.

Lets dive in and do some deductive reasoning.

1) First and foremost, the stitching on the tresse doesnt glow.

2) Here are some other examples of period boards w/ unusual tress / Luft boards w/ Heer tresse for good measure

[Nydigger1]

3) Lets take a look at the configuration / construction of the piece. The configuration is correct to WW2. DDR tabs and boards have a different look and style altogether.

Specifically if you look at the tresse configuration on the boards in question (w/ one of Darth's boards next to it) youll see that the tress at the base is placed over the rest of the tresse / the base piece has slanted ends as highlighted in the photo below.

Now comparing that to the DDR boards, youll see that the tress at the base is tucked under the tress that goes around the whole board as highlighted in the photo below.

[Nydigger1]

4) Regardless of which way you look at it, the boards and tabs themselves are original, the tresse is the only thing under consideration. HOWEVER we are quick to forget that this style of tress was used wartime as well! Below are some pictures from the following thread:

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...+tresse&page=2

^^^ Pretty much explains everything you would need to know about WW2 German tresse:

"Many different styles of tresse were used on Heer/SS uniforms during the Third Reich. Some of the tresse that was used had elongated diamonds in the pattern, though most patterns used square shapes. After the war, the East German NVA used a very similar tresse to the elongated diamond type used pre-1945. This has caused a lot of confusion, with some collectors erroneously believing that any tresse with elongated diamonds is fake or postwar. The real elongated diamond tresse can be seen in many reference books, for example "Uniforms of the Waffen-SS" by Michael Beaver p. 360-362. There is a difference between original elongated diamond and NVA tresse: the original stuff is made out of real aluminum wire, while the NVA used a synthetic material that looks and feels different."

[Nydigger1]

And Lastly:

5) Comparison with both wartime and postwar versions of the tress.

Picture 1 shows visible depressions in the tress of the WW2 board when the thread goes through the board yet is almost non existent on the NVA board. The FG boards being discussed have these depressions.

Pictures 2 & 3 show the thickness of the outer edge of the tress. Differences are highlighted in the pics.

Needless to say the boards being discussed here match the configuration of the WW2 board.

I rest my case but like I mentioned, any and all additional input is welcome.

[Nydigger1]

Almost forgot, the original photos of the pieces that I took. Cheers

[longislandercjv]

A word of caution regarding Feldgendarmerie insignia-- up until the beginning of the war orange was the color of recruiters and IMO most all Waffenrock insignia are likely from this period. Finding Fg shoulder straps meant for the field uniform is in my experience difficult and certainly some recruiter orange insignia were used by Fg units. Finding slip-on straps are more likely to be considered Fg insignia, and if you can find any in feldgrau then you really have something. The same goes for visor hats. Who can say if a pre-war hat was not used later by Feldgendarmerie, but finding one made of later war cloth is uncommon. This is only my observation and others will likely chime in with different views. You can count on tropical orange-piped straps being Fg. Best of luck collecting!

I agree;
Field gray straps piped in orange are hard to find.
I like slip on NCO straps with gray rayon tresse and rayon piping in particular.
Slip tabs with orange chainstitched unit numbers are rare also!

[Schulterklappen]

D16 and P16

This pair was originally mine. I welcome any additional discussion on this set. As we all know this hobby is a daily learning experience. Here are my 2 cents:

The question of the tress being post war, I must disagree disagree. Private purchase pieces were not held to the same standards as officially made pieces. Ive had and had seen enough boards over the years to know that theres a wide amount of room for variation including similar examples. That being said I have seen plenty of DDR pieces w/ WW2 correct tress as well.

Lets dive in and do some deductive reasoning.

1) First and foremost, the stitching on the tresse doesnt glow.

2) Here are some other examples of period boards w/ unusual tress / Luft boards w/ Heer tresse for good measure

The D16 and P16 represent the timeframe when the Heer was transitioning from Reichsheer. The early Heer continued to use the Waffle pattern tress before changing to diamond pattern.

http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/...ionen/16ID.htm