Denim and moleskin shoulder straps

[GOLGOTT]

Hello,

I have these 2 shoulder straps in my collection. Cloth of the right one is the classic moleskin with number 6 removed and P 41 added later (Panzer-Abwehr Abteilung 41).
Cloth of Left one (Pionier Bataillon 6) is a kind of denim, I have never seen this kind of cloth on reichswehr strap/ board. Maybe some collectors have anothers examples in their collection ?
Regards.
Yannick.

[Stive]

Fabric which is similar to denim was used on tropical shoulder straps

[pauke]

straps

Please show the tongues and full back sides.

[GOLGOTT]

Pictures:

[Tim O'Keefe]

Would like to hear from members that collect early shoulderstraps thoughts on these two straps and the cyphers ? I do not collect these but am curious ?

thanks

Tim

[GOLGOTT]

Fabric which is similar to denim was used on tropical shoulder straps

Agree, I didn't think denim was used so early on shoulder straps.

[Schulterklappen]

Straps

Only my opinion, but, I believe the Pionier 6 is original. That being said, it is an anomaly. The embroidery of the 6 is very well executed. If, you were going to such an extreme to produce a fake, why one with a more commonly encountered unit from the early Heer?

The moleskin P41 Unteroffizier is a beauty! It goes to show the pragmatic view the Germans took in in disposing of old models of clothing items. They "re-purposed"
items. You would think of moleskin straps being phased out during the transition from the Reichsheer to the Heer; but, here you have a moleskin strap, numbers picked out and new ones added. If you look at the history of Panzer-Abwehr Abt. 41, it is formed in Oktober, 1937.


I have seen moleskin straps with some variations in the materials used for their construction.

[galizien41]

Neat straps. I have never seen one like the Pioneer.

[longislandercjv]

Hello Tim;
these are both original straps.
As previously stated, the Pionere Abt. 6 is "non-standard" but an
original, untouched piece. Glen's rationale is noteworthy: who would make
up a fake strap from a very common unit of the Heer?
The Pz.Jaeger "P41" strap is particularly interesting in that is is a chainstitched
moleskin for the fatigue tunic and has been renumbered (i.e.," repurposed")
I like examples like this!
Good find Tim!!

[GOLGOTT]

Pionier strap came with a pair of pointed '46' bataillon (one still have a camo unit slide).

[Schulterklappen]

Pionier Btl. 46

Pionier strap came with a pair of pointed '46' bataillon (one still have a camo unit slide).

See this adds evidence to the originality of the #6 in my opinion. Part of the cadre for Pionier Btl. 46 was the 4. & 5. Kompanien of Pionier Btl. 6. Congratulations on a splendid find!

http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/...at/PiBat46.htm

[Tim O'Keefe]

Thankyou gentlemen, just what i was looking for

[pauke]

The only part I can say for certain is original is the moleskin part of the Pz. strap. The embroidery on it reminds me of the exceptional work done a number of years ago by Herr X (for lack of any name) who produced or reworked numerous rare or desirable straps on eBay. I think the tongue on the moleskin strap was added later and is the same work as the tongue maker on the "6" strap's tongue and the wool backside appears shortened. There's just something about the "P 41" embroidery that is uncomfortable to me. The "6" on the denim strap looks wonderful, but I recall the Herr X straps had some wonderful embroidery. The spliced cloth on the backside of the "6" strap gives me pause as it is more a war-time detail in my experience especially with Reichswehr straps which often have a stone gray backing of one piece of cloth. The extremely tight stitch around the edge of the "6" strap does not seem correct to me. What I cannot clearly see are thread and wool cloth details. Without seeing both straps in hand it isn't possible to be certain about originality, but there are too many anomalies to make me believe a clever person hasn't whipped these up. I'm likely the only one who thinks this but I've had a fair number of RW straps to think either of these is believable from these images. I enjoy soft boiled eggs for anyone throwing them!

[GOLGOTT]

Thank you everyone for the particpation. I have absolutely no doubt about the originality of the 2 straps. My initially question was to know if another collector have another example of denim reichswehr strap, maybe one will appear one day...

[madandi]

IMO they are just part of the moleskin RW-tunic linke the foto below.
I have a kavalleriergt 16 pair and could post some fotos later.