Schützen-Regiment 7: what waffenfarbe ?

[Höhe 112]

Hello everybody,

I hope to find help from the experts here.
I would like to know what is the correct waffenfarbe used on Schützen-Regiment 7 shoulderboards during the Westfeldzug May-June 1940 timeframe ?
Is it Goldgelb (Kavallerie) or Wiesengrün (Schützen)
or even Rosa like that one shown on http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...ad.php?t=69690


(ownership photo from WAF member Schulterklappen)

Thanks beforehand

Regards.

Höhe 112

[Schulterklappen]

Schuetzen Rgt. 7

It should be gold as Schuetzen Rgt. 7 traces its lineage to Kavallerie Schuetzen Rgt. 7 of the 2. Leichte Division. The particular strap that you show is a pre-war timeframe piece and a true anomaly with the Rosa Waffenfarbe. I got strap with lot of items belonging to the same soldier. The odd thing is that he was a member of Pionier Batallion 58 from the same division! The strap shown had metal numbers 58 over the rosa "S7".

Hello everybody,

I hope to find help from the experts here.
I would like to know what is the correct waffenfarbe used on Schützen-Regiment 7 shoulderboards during the Westfeldzug May-June 1940 timeframe ?
Is it Goldgelb (Kavallerie) or Wiesengrün (Schützen)
or even Rosa like that one shown on http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69690


(ownership photo from WAF member Schulterklappen)

Thanks beforehand

Regards.

Höhe 112

[afrikasandman]

Interesting strap but no doubt original and I wish it was in my collection. Matt

[Johnny R]

Is the Unit embroidery sewn through the board? They probably shifted to pink when SR 7 was assigned to Schutzen Brigade 7 and the 7th Panzer Division in late October 1939. There are pictures of these earlier boards being worn until the end of the War.

[Höhe 112]

Goldgelb waffenfarbe or Wiesengrün waffenfarbe ?

It should be gold as Schuetzen Rgt. 7 traces its lineage to Kavallerie Schuetzen Rgt. 7 of the 2. Leichte Division. The particular strap that you show is a pre-war timeframe piece and a true anomaly with the Rosa Waffenfarbe. I got strap with lot of items belonging to the same soldier. The odd thing is that he was a member of Pionier Batallion 58 from the same division! The strap shown had metal numbers 58 over the rosa "S7".

Thanks for your answers guy

I know that Schützen Rgt. 7 is originated from Kavallerie Schützen Rgt. 7 of the 2. Leichte Division but it was just the change of his name on February 1940 the 28th !
Can we claim that the Goldgelb waffenfarbe was always used on shoulderboards during the Westfeldzug May-June 1940 timeframe or was already changed to Wiesengrün ?

Regards

Höhe 112

[afrikasandman]

[QUOTE=Höhe 112;7311238]Thanks for your answers guy

Can we claim that the Goldgelb waffenfarbe was always used on shoulderboards during the Westfeldzug May-June 1940 timeframe or was already changed to Wiesengrün ?

I wouldn't claim that, there are always exceptions to everything. Matt

[Johnny R]

After Oct. 1939 (and in France) SR 7/SB 7 would in theory be wearing Pink, the green may have not used until they were designated Panzer Gren Rgt 7 in 1942. Some Schutzen units did not use the green waffenfarbe and kept panzer or Cav. yellow waffenfarbe until changed to Panzer Gren. and other Schutzen units retained pink and golden yellow until the end of the War.

[Höhe 112]

After Oct. 1939 (and in France) SR 7/SB 7 would in theory be wearing Pink, the green may have not used until they were designated Panzer Gren Rgt 7 in 1942. Some Schutzen units did not use the green waffenfarbe and kept panzer or Cav. yellow waffenfarbe until changed to Panzer Gren. and other Schutzen units retained pink and golden yellow until the end of the War.

Hello Johnny

Can you explain why Schützen Rgt. 7 would in theory be wearing Pink ?
I search about that rule and can't find any
We also know that Schützen Rgt. 7 became Panzer-Grenadier-Regiment 7 on July 1942 the 5th and the Wiesengrün waffenfarbe became the rule but I came across that m36 shoulder board #7 in dark green with the correct Wiesengrün waffenfarbe and I wonder if it could be from the May-June 1940 timeframe I search.

Sorry for this small sized photo ©
but it's only what I found on wehrmacht-lexikon.de

anyway thanks for your help

regards

Höhe 112

[Schulterklappen]

S7

Here are some more and better scans of the strap in question. The stitching does not go through; so, one would assume it was made that way. It has stone gray material for the backing. I did not know that Kav. Schuetzen regiments made the changeover to pink Waffenfarbe. Slip-on straps and boards would have been easy to change, sew-in pieces and collar tabs...

Then again, I have never been in the army!

[Schulterklappen]

S6 & s7

I think I do remember seeing tailor made sew-in S6 & S7 pieces in rosa Waffenfarbe. The never ending Waffenfarbe mystery; I do love it so!

[Johnny R]

The sew in green piped board with the "7" you posted is most likely for elements of the II Battalion of IR 7 which were Jager and wore the green Waffenfarbe.

The panzer idea is from seeing the board which is obviously original and from knowing what happened with insignia in many cases when "Light Divisions" were assimilated or changed into Panzer Divisions.

Pink was to replace golden yellow (in most cases) for motorized infantry units in Panzer Divisions while aufklaurings in many cases kept it based on orders dating to the summer and Fall of 1938.

An order of July 31st , 1938 stipulated that Schutzen Rifle Regiments assigned to armored formations would wear pink. Schutzen units still assigned to Light Divisions continued to wear golden yellow.

All motorized Schutzen Infantry units assigned to Light Divisions and Panzer formations after 19 September 1939 were to be wearing the Wiesengrun but these regulations or directives were not always followed.

[Höhe 112]

Here are some more and better scans of the strap in question. The stitching does not go through; so, one would assume it was made that way. It has stone gray material for the backing. I did not know that Kav. Schuetzen regiments made the changeover to pink Waffenfarbe. Slip-on straps and boards would have been easy to change, sew-in pieces and collar tabs...

Then again, I have never been in the army!

Thanks for your help Schulterklappen

[Höhe 112]

I think I do remember seeing tailor made sew-in S6 & S7 pieces in rosa Waffenfarbe. The never ending Waffenfarbe mystery; I do love it so!

[Höhe 112]

The sew in green piped board with the "7" you posted is most likely for elements of the II Battalion of IR 7 which were Jager and wore the green Waffenfarbe.

The panzer idea is from seeing the board which is obviously original and from knowing what happened with insignia in many cases when "Light Divisions" were assimilated or changed into Panzer Divisions.

Pink was to replace golden yellow (in most cases) for motorized infantry units in Panzer Divisions while aufklaurings in many cases kept it based on orders dating to the summer and Fall of 1938.

An order of July 31st , 1938 stipulated that Schutzen Rifle Regiments assigned to armored formations would wear pink. Schutzen units still assigned to Light Divisions continued to wear golden yellow.

All motorized Schutzen Infantry units assigned to Light Divisions and Panzer formations after 19 September 1939 were to be wearing the Wiesengrun but these regulations or directives were not always followed.

Thanks Johnny,

But if the sew in green piped board with the "7" I've posted is most likely for elements of the 8 or 9 Kp from II Battalion of IR 7 which were Jäger (Schlesisches Jäger-Bataillon "von Neumann" Nr. 5 and Schlesisches Grenadier-Regiment "König Friedrich III" Nr. 11): they normaly wore the Hellgrün Waffenfarbe instead of Wiesengrün waffenfarbe
(Gem. „Grundlegenden Befehl Nr. 21“ AHA Stab IB (Bekl) 2 – September 1944)

And as Shulterklappen replied: it's a never ending Waffenfarbe mystery

Regards

Höhe 112

[derka]

An order of July 31st , 1938 stipulated that Schutzen Rifle Regiments assigned to armored formations would wear pink. Schutzen units still assigned to Light Divisions continued to wear golden yellow.

All motorized Schutzen Infantry units assigned to Light Divisions and Panzer formations after 19 September 1939 were to be wearing the Wiesengrun but these regulations or directives were not always followed.

I fully agree with Johnny's last observations above.
For instance, that's why you can find M34 sidecaps dated 1939, 1940, 1941 an 1942 with Wiesengrun soutache, despite the fact this color was finaly adopted for panzergrenadiere oficialy july 5th 1942 only.
derka