Interesting photo: Penal unit (former) officer?

[NickG]

This photo from Koningsberg April 1945 shows a group of mixed German POW's.
I see an SS pattern Kharkov parka, Heer splinter parka and a LW prisoner with an army side cap...
but most interesting is the officer in the foreground.

He is clearly wearing
- an officers quality smooth wool M36 great coat
- an officers side cap with silver piping + BeVo silver cap eagle...
- unpiped enlisted shoulderstraps!
Demotion? Penal?

Could this be a penal unit (former) officer? Disciplinary Unit member?
The second image I borrowed from an old post from JacquesF which shows a penal shoulderstrap lacking any piping....

[mwliles]

It is always interesting to see these type of photos. IMO he is not an officer! It appears that they have already been "segragated" and the Officers and NCOs have been taken out of this group. This is one of the first things that happens to POWs is that you strip the leadership out so they do not start organizing an escape. The Overcoat appears to be an early issue one that is made of some type of smooth wool. Not sure where he found the hat that appears to have been partially piped. I think it is also a stretch to say that the insignia is silver wire. This man does not display the "martial" qualities that is present in most German Officers but it is 1945 it is not impossible he is an Officer. As they are prisoners of the Soviets those smiles will be short lived when the official cameras leave and the reality of a cruel new Socialist reality emerges.
Marion

[DonC]

I suspect he is wearing whatever he could get in 1945.

Don

[NickG]

Yeah its all just speculation....but it would be interesting if he was a penal guy with officer status removed!
Of course if that is the case he would not have been considered an officer anymore, hence the unpiped enlisted straps...
and therefore he would not have been segregated as an officer as that status was canceled...now serving in a "Bewährungstruppe" (penal) unit
and becoming a POW with the other non-officers...

He did keep the higher quality overcoat and cap...This cap does appears to also have been made in officers quality smooth wool, matching the overcoat...
and the shoulderstraps are clearly unpiped...
Who knows?

Here the scene from the Stalingrad (1993) when the Lieutenant and his men get their status back after serving time in a "Bewahrungs" (penal) unit!
Note officers cap piping and Lt shoulderboards. In the movie they "did time" without wearing any generic unpiped shoulderboards/shoulderstraps....

[NickG]

Looks like M44 (unpiped penal?) shoulderstraps (note stitching) and also a close up of his cap in smooth wool with flat wire silver eagle
and scalloped edge piping!

[Fred Green]

Hello,

He is definitely not a penal soldier. They were stripped of all rank and entitlements. They were not allowed to wear the state colors or the hoheitsabzeichen. He is just like the luft guy behind him. He picked up a hat.

Fred

[Johnny R]

Up hill both ways on some streets I guess.

[NickG]

Hello,

He is definitely not a penal soldier. They were stripped of all rank and entitlements. They were not allowed to wear the state colors or the hoheitsabzeichen. He is just like the luft guy behind him. He picked up a hat.

Fred

OK no go on Penal...I admit it was a longshot....
True Fred, the eagle would have been removed from the hat (not the case here) which kills this theory...did not think about that discrepancy...
In Stalingrad movie they removed the cap insignia too...The Lieutenant kept his roundel still...



and penal buckles were plain pebbled enlisted types void of any design, so no eagle either. Good points!
You are funny Johnny! No eagle like on the tin foil hat
Thought I found something interesting...oh well...but the straps do appear to be unpiped types like Jacques' surviving example! Who knows what that represents?

I have some paperwork on "Bewährungstruppe 999" which served in Africa (penal unit) so I was interested in this topic...
Photo credits go to as tagged!

Here's a "Afrika" map and "Gesundheitsbuch" (G-Buch), basically a health and inoculation records book
(important for the tropics) both formerly owned by a "Afrika Brigade 999" member, originaly a disciplinary unit! (Straf einheit)

[Johnny R]

I think late War/surrender photos are interesting but there was a lot going on. They grabbed (as noted above) whatever they could find. Most the men in that photo most likely died in captivity. I had veteran friends who were not released until 1954 and 90% of the people in their units they surrendered with never returned to Germany.

[Johnny R]

Look at surrender photos to verify. I think you will find it true.

[NickG]

I think late War/surrender photos are interesting but there was a lot going on. They grabbed (as noted above) whatever they could find. Most the men in that photo most likely died in captivity. I had veteran friends who were not released until 1954 and 90% of the people in their units they surrendered with never returned to Germany.

Yeah sad situation being held for almost a decade after the war...
The POW's in the West fared a lot better and enjoyed these kind of activities
after release...
Hannover 1953: Watch the whole clip! (these guys also picked up some head gear!)

http://www.britishpathe.com/video/ha...query/football

[heinrich66]

But i have seen a few officer worn board, wo were in fact em board, with the pips addes. Some frontline officers prefered them over the "shiny" boards in fear of snipers.....