Panzer Aufklarungs Collar Tabs.

[jules61]

Hi Gents|
I would like Yours opinions on these Tabs!
Thanks for yours time!
Have a nice day!
Gian.

Collar Tabs 022.JPG

Collar Tabs 024.JPG

[jules61]

[ATTACH]3041934[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]3041935[/ATTACH]

[OSS]

Piping looks ok but the construction is unlike any originals I have seen.

[90th Light]

I have seen a veteran brought back panzer wrap tab exactly like that. It had that exact type of skull but was piped pink not yellow.

Whoever the maker was before May 1945, they seem to have used a different type of backing. It is like some kind of tough cardboard with the black linen/ rayon cloth sewn over it on the reverse side rather than the regular exposed buckram one usually sees.

Cardboard backing is also sometimes seen on SS collar tabs. This is the panzer collar tab equivalent,

Chris

[jules61]

Hi Chris

My doubt was right in the back!
I had never seen Panzer Collar Tabs like that.
Now everything is clear!
Now!......they are very comfortable around this Panzer hat!
Thanks for the info!
Gian.

Panzeraufklarungtruppe1 204.JPG

Panzeraufklarungtruppe1 206.JPG

[90th Light]

Hello Gian,

I will add some images to this thread as soon as I get a chance to do so.

Did you find your Pz. Recon tabs in Italy and do you think that they were used there between 1943-45 ???

The reason that I ask this is because the pink piped examples that I know of were NZ veteran brought back from Italy 43-45

Chris

[jules61]

Hi Chris!

I don't know from where they come from!
May be from the battle of Montecassino???
Why No!!
Gian.

[90th Light]

Hi Chris!

I don't know from where they come from!
May be from the battle of Montecassino???
Why No!!
Gian.

Hello Gian,

reading this again and with hindsight, I am probably wasting my time putting up images of the NZ vet tab. Given that OSS a very advanced collector has not seen this type then anything I put up will probably be dismissed. Unless respected panzer collectors on this forum have also seen this type.

I contacted the collector/ historian who documented the find. He said that he "Montecassino" was a bit off the mark. This type of panzer tab turned up later than that during tank action on the drive to Florence. Another possibility for your tabs is a member of 26 Pz. A.A.

In regard to the the example here in NZ, here is a bit of backround;


"The line of advance along the ridges now lay almost north. Ahead could be seen the first of those magnificent villas of Tuscany which the Kiwis were so often to meet and live in on the way to Florence. On B Squadron's front was the Villa Bonazza, with thick shrubberies and plantations all round it, and a mere 400 yards ahead of A Squadron the Villa Strada (christened by the Kiwis ‘The Castle’), even bigger and more imposing, and surrounded by a high wall. In and round these two houses Jerry was strongly established, covering the Strada ridge and the road forward of Tavarnelle with Spandaus and mortars.

Here A Squadron had its worst ‘brew-up’, a shocking affair which had a very bad effect on all who saw it. Corporal Don Cates's6 tank, hit by an anti-tank shell from somewhere round the Castle, burst into flames too suddenly for the crew to get clear—Trooper John Kingsford7 was killed and all the rest badly burned, Cates and Trooper ‘Toby’ Donaldson8 fatally. Such a disaster was calculated to take the edge off the tankies' confidence quicker than anything else, especially as the whisper was now going round, ‘Tigers ahead, look out!’ They had heard plenty about the Tiger tank, Germany's biggest and toughest, 60 tons of armour plate mounting an 88-millimetre gun, able to outclass a Sherman anywhere. The bravest tank crew would think twice before tackling a Tiger in cold blood.

After a few shells on the Castle, 23 Battalion went into the attack at 1.30 p.m., with the remaining A Squadron tanks covering them from the Strada ridge. Here the victorious advance had its first bad check. The Castle and its grounds were stiff with Germans, and they threw everything at the attackers, who fell back on Strada in some dismay."

(Victoria University Wellington)

Chris

[jules61]

Hi Chris!

The assembly of these insignia is identical to all other Pz. insignia, materials and construction. Except that for the reverse.
It may be that in the future an example like mine can jump out!
For the moment I put them in a drawer!
Thanks anyway for your research!
And the story of the NZ veterans!
You've been very kind!
Gian.

[jules61]

Hi Chris!
One example like mine has jump out in selling at Ratisbons Auction!
Same Jellow/Gold Piping, same Skull and same reverse!

http://www.ratisbons.com/2nd-Contemp...ollar-tab.html

2000000007816-1.jpg

2000000007816-3.jpg

Have a nice New Year!
Gian.

[longislandercjv]

I agree with OSS (post#3).

It all comes down to what an individual collector
likes and thinks he knows.

As I was told decades ago by the late Fred Boes:
"kid, you like it you buy it, you don't like it you don't buy it".

This one is not one I'd buy.

[galizien41]

Ah "Fake Freddie". I remember him 20 years ago.

I agree on these. Skulls are all fake IMO opinion also. But if you like it and am comfy with them then so be it.

I agree with OSS (post#3).

It all comes down to what an individual collector
likes and thinks he knows.

As I was told decades ago by the late Fred Boes:
"kid, you like it you buy it, you don't like it you don't buy it".

This one is not one I'd buy.

[echoe]

pz backing

same dilemma.... different insignia.
there may be a pre-war pair out there with this construction. but i'm nervous about the reason for placing a cover of any kind on the reverse of these tabs. and even though it's a far reach -- there are undoubtedly many pieces of insignia that found their way back from italy -- i have heard the italy cover story used for insignia that was less than believable for many years.
i like the statement - "if you like it , buy it"

[PANZERPIONIERE]

I have seen that type of backing / covering on Pz. Tabs before. As for the rest of the tab, I have doubts.

[echoe]

tab backing

well, steve has seen a helluva lot more panzer stuff than me.