Adjutant waffenfarbe question.

[panzeriv]

Would the adjutant of an early war panzer division wear the carmine waffenfarbe of the general staff or the pink of the panzer division?
I'm still trying to figure out the complexites of the general staff waffenfarbe.

thanks
Scott

[Michael Everett]

Color

If he was a "qualified" General Staff Officer, he would wear the carmine. I would suspect however, that most I.G. Staff Officer's served as commanders, operations officer's, or planners.

MIKE

[Simon O.]

From what i've seen, generally speaking the officers of a divisions adjutantur (IIa and IIb) were not general staff officers. Perhaps because these positions delt with personnel matters they didn't require the specialist skills of i.G officers

[Mike H]

...

Scott,

You are lucky to have two of the best guys (Michael and Simon) commenting on this thread you could possibly wish for.

Best wishes for the New Year!

Mike

[DonC]

Most of the period photos I have seen of Adjutanten show them in their branch Waffenfarbe - I don't recall seeing any in GS collar tabs or boards.

Don

[panzeriv]

thank you Gentlemen for your superb and quick replies.

I love this forum!


Scott

[Michael Everett]

I.g.

I took a quick look through the HEERESEINTEILUNG 1939 and checked about 10-15 Corps and Division Headquarters and they all had as their IIa (adjutant) a "line" staff officer NOT, a I.G.

Mike

[Simon O.]

Most of the period photos I have seen of Adjutanten show them in their branch Waffenfarbe - I don't recall seeing any in GS collar tabs or boards.

Don

Just to be sure. There are two seperate things here, the adjutantur positions of IIa and IIb, who could be referred to as adjutants, and an adjutant or ADC to a senior officer who would wear an aiguillette.

[pierluigi]

In my collection i've an adjutant Major jacket with carminium waffenfarbe that was of Maj. Wack . He should have been at the end of the war in the stab kp of 232 I.D. that surrendered in northern italy. Don you think it could be right?
Thanks

[DonC]

Yes, if he was an actual General Staff officer, carmine would be appropriate. As Simon said, there is a difference between ADC type adjutant who wore the adjutant's aiguillette and the actual staff officer positions. My comments were directed toward the former.

Don

[Johnny R]

Major Heinz-Peter Wack was a Officer in the General Staff after 30 Jan 1945 who was was assigned as Ib of 232 ID from 5 Feb. 1945 until at the end of the War. The carmine piping and GS style tabs would be correct for his uniform.

[Panzer Bob]

Two-cent's worth...

GS piping would have been rare, even at the division level. In general, only two GS officers were authorized on divisional staffs, the operations officer and the log(istics) officer. GS officers did serve throughout the division, but they were participating in the "muddy boots" program of the German Army, which required GS officers to serve in actual command positions at all levels as they progressed in rank. Generally, they would have worn the appropriate branch color for those positions, e.g. pink for armor, white for infantry etc.
Regards,
Bob

[panzeriv]

wow, more great info from all of you, thanks.
One more question. What does ADC adjutant refer to?

Scott

[Johnny R]

wow, more great info from all of you, thanks.
One more question. What does ADC adjutant refer to?

Scott

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aide-de-camp

[panzeriv]

Thank you Mr. Johnny R. Much appreciated.

Scott