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    #46
    nice recovery.It looks great!

    Comment

      #47
      Originally posted by Johnny R View Post
      The bergrocks had closures at the cuffs similar to the Windjacke. If you can find descriptions of the HBTs being specific for GJ in period literature with the closure I will believe you. Buttons came in boxes of hundreds and tailoring at unit level is as good and often better than factory work so those ideas fall to the side of the road quickly.

      I think this like some of the other "interesting" ideas for CTs and odd tunics is best left as a theory without hard facts other than assertions.

      As I mentioned I have seen other branch tunics with a neck closure added. The GJ patch on your HBT is not seated either and does not show wear or age (like the repair, the eagle, and the KVK ribbon) and probably also was recently added IMO.
      Fair enough! Your reasons make sense for it not to be exclusively GJ. Could very well be a collectors fable...
      To get more input I have sent a PM to one of the WAF's mountain troop collectors for his opinion!
      Lets wait and see what he says when he chimes in! I appreciate your insight as usual Johnny!

      Comment

        #48
        I will look through my tunics, I am pretty sure I have some with the closure that are not badged as GJ but I am not sure. I know I have seen them on jackets that are infantry etc.

        Comment

          #49
          Originally posted by Johnny R View Post
          I will look through my tunics, I am pretty sure I have some with the closure that are not badged as GJ but I am not sure. I know I have seen them on jackets that are infantry etc.
          Please do! I would love to see those non GJ examples and debunk the
          GJ trait theory! I did read about it somewhere I just don't remember where...Had to have been in a reference books...was pre internet days...
          but probably was an assumption on the part of the author than...

          but it still does make sense for a GJ (at least on a woolen uniform...)
          erect the collar and keep it in position with the "GJ tab" and add an extra layer of neck protection as depicted by these GJ troops in this picture!
          No doubt they all have their collars turned upright for added warmth! Check out the knitted civilian head protection!
          Attached Files

          Comment

            #50
            Found it!
            H & C was showing it as a special feature on their GJ impression...
            (on a M40 wool GJ tunic, oval tab connected differently but same idea!)
            So that's where it came from as a reference... but it just states to be non regulation...( so I guess not necessarily unique to GJ truppen?)
            Who knows?
            Attached Files
            Last edited by NickG; 10-14-2013, 09:59 PM.

            Comment

              #51
              Nick, from the mid 1930s the GJ were issued a special wool "M36" style tunic called a "Bergrock", it had the kidney shaped enclosure at the neck and had little pull straps at the wrists like a Wind Jacket to close the sleeves. They stopped manufacturing this type of tunic in 1940. After that many tunics issued to GJ units were modified and the neck closure added to standard issue tunics which is what they are showing in the article/chapter. I think I have seen three issue Bergrocks in almost 40 years of collecting and they are very rare.

              Towards HBT bergrocks, I remain unconvinced. All M44s had a similar tab added and they are not for GJ. If you found a first pattern HBT with wrist straps and the neck closure it would be more believable. The enclosures also would be helpful for road dust etc. so maybe were added for that. Hard to say.

              Comment

                #52
                Originally posted by Johnny R View Post
                They stopped manufacturing this type of Bergrock tunic in 1940. After that many tunics issued to GJ units were modified and the neck closure added to standard issue tunics which is what they are showing in the article.
                So you are saying it's a GJ thing after all (idea stemming from Bergrocks), but still strange it was also done on such a light weight HBT....less convinced...

                I'm still a believer...Here's another example: M36 in wool which was shared earlier this year by member Albert!
                These tabs are only appearing on Mountain unit related uniforms so far....If we could only find another HBT with this modification that's unequivocally GJ related!
                That would be great!
                Attached Files

                Comment

                  #53
                  Enjoy yourself with this.

                  Comment

                    #54
                    Originally posted by Johnny R View Post
                    Enjoy yourself with this.
                    I will!
                    The upright collar has been explained in this thread as dust protection or to repel mosquitos or even shielding against spent ammo shells...
                    all interesting theories and not specifically branch related, but I still think its related to mountaineering use.

                    In the winter protection against the cold is obvious, especially with wool tunics, but in any weather condition (also during the warmer months,
                    while wearing light weight HBT's) the habit of turning the collar upright protects against Alpine sun burn!

                    Reflective surfaces, such as water and snow, increase the risk of sun damage as these surfaces also reflect ultraviolet (UV) radiation.
                    In some cases you can almost get a double dose of UV – directly from the sun and then AGAIN through reflection of those same damaging rays!
                    In fact, clean snow reflects up to 90% of UV radiation (like a mirror!) and that UV gets 4% stronger for each 300meter rise in altitude!

                    So neck protection is absolutely crucial! An important Alpine issue...hence the GJ neck tab modification!
                    That remains my take on this practice in the field, while exposed to the elements!
                    Attached Files
                    Last edited by NickG; 10-16-2013, 01:16 AM.

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