Thoughts on this White HBT PZ Wrap Tunic and Pants

[Leroy]

Where, then, are the real ones? We know they exist, but no one here seems to be able to show us one to tell, definitively, good from bad.

I have the distinct impression that, despite all the good intentions in the world, no one can competently say (except in the case of the most obvious fakes)what is good and what is not.

[derka]

re,

green hbt or denim pz suits are pretty rare.
but compare to them, white ones are almost like Moby Dick among others whales...
so comparizon is difficult, but logicaly, there are no reasons to believe that white suits were manufactured in a different way than green suits, hence same carateristics should be found.
just my 2 cents.
derka

[Leroy]

With all due respect, who is to say that only one manufacturer, or only one version, existed?

I have "no dog in this fight" and am only looking for the most accurate data.

[derka]

re,

in this case, if you look closely, you are suposed to have here a "matching" suit, wrapper and trousers.
but they don't.
wrapper's cut is for "Drillichschutzanzug für die Besatzungen der Panzersähwagen",
trouser's cut is for "Drillichschutzanzug fûr Panzertruppen".
same very good condition, but both with "original" stamping faded...
and as far i know, for both of those two different suits, wrapper has ALWAYS a metal hook and eye at the colar.
this is not a question of variation in minor technical caracteristics or design, neither of a particular manufacturer.

derka

[Leroy]

Good observation, Derka! Maybe we ARE getting somewhere, after all.

You would think, with this work, a faker could have found and put on the hook and eye.

Here's one (obviously in different material), but no hook and eye.

[derka]

re,

yes, i know this pic,
here is another one, shown of the forum :



those wrappers are not regular ones,
nothing to do with the 2 types of pz suits i mentioned.
and the lack of hook and eye is obvious, but not the only point.

derka

[Leroy]

Yes, the second one is, I believe, wearing the standard jacket for a waiter in the officer's mess.

Are you saying that the ones made in HBT are all exactly alike, both green and white? Again, I have no reason to fight here, but I would like to see close-up examples of the "good" ones which MUST be out there.

Does HSC make these?

[derka]

re,

i'm just saying that even with minor variations and the fact that differents manufacturers made them,
regular green hbt pz suits (trousers and wrappers) of the 2 types have same general caracteristics of construction each.
presence of colar hook and eye is an exemple.
from my point of wiew, some of those points are "dead kisses".
my belief is that it is the same for white suits, if regular made.

for your last question, i don't know,
but if HSC sold (i don't say "made") lots of hbt fakes items,
unfortunatly there are several others "manufacturers" too in fakery...

derka

[Leroy]

Thank you, Derka! Do you know of anyone who has a real example to look at?

[derka]

re,

you mean a real white one ?
i think at least one forum member has one.
try a search with "white drillich" and "hbt pz wrap" on the forum,
i let you make your opinion on this subject, wich has ever been discussed.
remember, we all try to educate ourselves, and agree to disagree sometimes...

derka

[Leroy]

Yes, Derka, I have read those threads. No white ones shown as being real that I could see. Lots of different examples of green, though.

I believe these are close to the "Great White" flight jacket every LW collector would like to have.

Oh, well, perhaps a real one will be posted in response to this thread.

Thanks for your good thoughts!

[Luca Ongaro]

I have in my collection a white HBT wrap with a story aside and this has the same HBT material as that one posted here.
No stamps in my wrap (maybe faded) and no metal hook and eye at the colar.

Richard I have not idea why the arms in those examples are so short

Luca

[Leroy]

Luca,
Great photo! Could we see close-ups, please?
Best,
Leroy

[airborne_steve]

Hi Luca,

I would love to see more detailed photos of your white wrap. I have never touched a white wrap so any help here would be appreciated.

Thanks. Steve

[derka]

Luca,
is there zigzag stiching under the colar of your white wrap ?
derka