Sonderführer Shoulder Board?

[DonC]

This is on a Heer Sonderführer tunic with the gray collar. Are these even close? I thought they had interwoven red and black chevrons? The Waffenfarbe is dark blue-gray. As always, any help appreciated!


Don

[echoe]

s fuhrer

i don't think i have ever seen tabs attached in that way.

[Hans Kristian]

Hi Don,

Well, the collar tabs on this tunic are the type introduced in March 1940. At the same time, they introduced the shoulder boards that you refer to, the red/black threads as on the photo attached.
But in december of 1942 there was a new change in the insignia: They kept the collar tab and the grey color, but replaced the shoulder boards with shoulder cords - like the ones on your tunic. So, the tuniic represents the last configuration for the Sonderführer. The rank represents a Sonderführer Stellengruppe B, rank-equivalent is Major. He would be an Abteilungsführer or Battalionsführer.

I can make scans from a really good book if you need.

Hans Kristian

[Hans Kristian]

i don't think i have ever seen tabs attached in that way.

wow, agree, they are turned the wrong way..!..

[DonC]

Yes, I noticed the backward tabs as well - could be a rebuild.

Don

[Johnny R]

It is very very doubtful it was ever worn with the tabs upside down. More likely incorrectly restored by someone that did not know what they were doing.

[Johnny R]

Here is one for the B group rank and the first pattern insignia with the tabs showing the way they should be applied.

[DonC]

John, Hans, and Echoe - thanks very much for your help!


Don

[PaulR]

Please don't rule it out yet... please send closer images of the collar tabs and under the collar. I want to see how it was sewn and signs of previous insignia placement. I've seen funky things with beamter, like this. They were not considered to be military, so they were not held to the same account as regular military. Also, beamter were expected to purchase their own uniforms and insignia application- lots of room for blunder and there is plenty of photographic evidence to support that.


I like the shoulder cords and their application, based upon the few photos I see here.


In summary, I'd like to see more images of the critical insignia application points- barring that- I am hopeful.

[DonC]

Hey Paul -


It was on auction on eBay - went for $850 with shipping, which I think is a bit high given condition.


Don

[PaulR]

I hear you. Better safe than sorry.

[Sprachfuehrer]

Moin!
Sonderführer B, ab 1942
Kragenspiegel sind nicht korrekt genäht, aber es gab sowas auch ))
Übrigens wurde es genau nicht vorgeschrieben, wie man die Spiegelspitze ausrichten muss
Gruss
Andrej

[Sprachfuehrer]

Ein Beispiel noch...img366.jpg

[Hans Kristian]

Ein Beispiel noch...img366.jpg

Wow, so it could be original...thanks for sharing the photo, Andrej.

[MrSimh]

Hello,

I have draw the list here, its for medical speciality but its almost the same elsewhere (without the medical snake).


01/09/1939 - 21/03/1940
http://ww2.tenebrae.ovh/all_san_sonder.html
21/03/1940 - 06/12/1942 (this last rank may be not have been awarded during this years)
http://ww2.tenebrae.ovh/all_san_sonder2.html
06/12/1942 - 08/05/1945 (the last one is yours, but without the gold snake for medical)
http://ww2.tenebrae.ovh/all_san_sonder3.html

Consider that the website is unfinished but this could be already helpfull.

Thank you