NSDAP flag pole topper - salty - RZM M3/40/38

[hunmilitaria]

Hi,

I need your opinions about this NSDAP flag pole topper.
RZM M3/40/38

[Berghof]

It's a good one.


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[mrec27777]

looks like an original!!!..that laid in a crawspace under a house for 70 years ... EC

[Berghof]

looks like an original!!!..that laid in a crawspace under a house for 70 years ... EC

For sure!

[Br. James]

This piece appears to be a 2nd Issue PL topper, made by the firm of Gebrüder Cosack of Neheim, produced in 1938 -- a firm which made thousands of toppers for various NSDAP organizations. This topper was made of aluminum, and I can see no reason why the visible condition should be so poor, given that aluminum doesn't rust. Does this piece really just need to be given a nice bath in soapy water...or is more going on here than we can see? And the second question, for hunmilitaria, is: If you are thinking of buying this piece for your collection, how long will you be satisfied with it as-is? These 2nd Issue PL toppers are widely available in our hobby and are normally found in fine condition, so if you buy this one and then want to upgrade it in the future, who will you sell this one to? Condition should always be a major concern when considering adding an artifact to our collections...IMHO, of course!

Cheers,

Br. James

[rlimike]

As the others stated, it's an original topper & it's a shame that it's in that condition.
Regards,
Michael H.

[Military]

Does anyone know the various markings / manufacturers used for the second pattern NSDAP pole tops?

Mil

[oldflagswanted]

NSDAP eagle top maker list ???

Does anyone know the various markings
/ manufacturers used for the second pattern
NSDAP pole tops?
Mil

Hello Mil:
That would be an interesting list. Suggest
a review of related WAF threads to do it.
........OFW

[Military]

Hello Mil:
That would be an interesting list. Suggest
a review of related WAF threads to do it.
........OFW

Thanks, OFW... something of a small project to-do.

Mil

[Stahlhelm]

This topper was made of aluminum, and I can see no reason why the visible condition should be so poor, given that aluminum doesn't rust. Does this piece really just need to be given a nice bath in soapy water...or is more going on here than we can see?
Cheers,

Br. James

I'll add what I know about aluminum, because of my own experience with it. Aluminum doesn't rust like iron, with pieces of metal sprawling off of it. However, it can oxidize. When it does, it produces exactly that type of white material on the surface. The wheels of my jeep are made of aluminum, and in less than six years that same type of white oxidation formed on them, and it is still there now, still progressing. So, that is exactly what could form on aluminum out in the elements for an extended amount of time. If you Google "aluminum oxidation", you will also see photos of it. I just thought I would add that to answer your question, and be helpful.

P.S. Actually, I wish aluminum didn't oxidize, and I would have much better looking wheels on my Jeep right now.

Cheers,

Chris

[Br. James]

Thanks for sharing your expertise, Chris -- very helpful!

Every day I learn something new on WAF!

Cheers, my friend, and do stay safe,

Br. James

[Berghof]

For those who have nothing else to do right now...like myself.

Here's a good write up that I snagged...

Rust vs Corrosion
Most metals want to corrode back to some form of ore. (Gold is one notable exception.) Corrosion starts with oxidation, where atoms of metal link up with oxygen, followed by a gradual, or not so gradual, breakdown. Rusting is a specialized form of corrosion that only iron and steel go through.

Rust is when the iron oxidizes and flakes off. It’s accelerated by moisture. Flaking exposes fresh metal beneath, which in turn oxidizes and flakes.

Aluminum oxidation happens faster than that of steel, because aluminum has a really strong affinity for oxygen. Rather than flaking though, aluminum oxide just forms a hard, whitish-colored surface skin. When all the aluminum atoms have bonded with oxygen the oxidation process stops.

Aluminum Corrosion
Scratching this oxide skin exposes bare metal, and the process begins again. It won’t eat the metal away though, except under two conditions. First, if chlorides or sulfides are around they’ll attack the aluminum oxide layer.

Chlorides are compounds of chlorine. Sodium chloride would be an example, which is the chemical name for salt. And where do you find lots of salt? In the ocean. Likewise, sulfides are sulfur compounds. They’re prevalent in areas of polluted air.

Second, if conditions are right you could experience galvanic corrosion. this is an electrical effect experienced when dissimilar metals are brought close together in a conducting liquid. For example, immerse brass and aluminum in seawater and electrons move from the aluminum to the brass. This can be a problem in boats where brass fittings are close to or even in contact with aluminum. (Fuel tanks are a prime example.)

Preventing Aluminum Corrosion
You can’t do much about aluminum oxidation, and unless appearance matters, it’s not a big problem. Aluminum corrosion could however be a serious issue. If there’s any possibility of it happening you have two options:

Apply a protective coating.
Minimize or mitigate the effect of galvanic corrosion.
You should also consider the grade or series of aluminum you’re using. Some of theses, notably 5052 and 3003, have better corrosion-resistance properties than others. More generally, 1xxx, 3xxx, 5xxx and 6xxx series alloys offer good corrosion resistance.

Protective Coatings
There are three options:

Paint
Powder coat
Anodize
If you’re concerned about galvanic corrosion look for paint or powder with high electrical resistance. Anodizing is a kind of surface oxidation that can produce some very attractive finishes. However, it’s not usually practical for larger fabrications.

If taking the coating approach, don’t forget that any damage needs immediate attention. Leave some aluminum exposed and you risk corrosion getting a toehold.

Preventing Galvanic Corrosion
Ideally, keep the aluminum dry. The galvanic effect can’t work without an electrically-conductive liquid between the two metals. If that’s not possible, try to use electrically insulating coatings.

Many boaters also use a sacrificial anode made of zinc. This corrodes faster than the aluminum, in effect, sacrificing itself. Sacrificial anodes do need replacing periodically, but then so will most coatings.

[mrec27777]

great info for everyone,BERGHOF!!!! EC

[Stahlhelm]

Yes! Definitely great information, Berghof! I knew that aluminum oxidizes, but I did not know so many specifics about it.

Thanks!

[Berghof]

You're welcome guys. I notice damp basements/garages have a profound negative effect on aluminum. A lot of guys stored their railroad eagles/tops in those locations and you can really tell.

Interesting to note that oxidation actually provides a thin layer of barrier oxide for corrosion resistance. I guess you can assume some of these items with deep corrosive issues were stored in an environment where there was some sort of salts nearby....such as the original poster pole top...maybe near the sea shore. I grew up by the sea shore and anything metal eventually got hammered.


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