Railroad Eagle question

[BobI]

Hi Robert and Greg!
Actually, this is definitely not a RR eagle. It is the type of eagle that was affixed to buildings. The way you tell is by the attachment method. The big bolts like the one Greg posted are for trains. The ones with coned stalk like Roberts are for buildings. Normally there are screws coming from the hole in the top of the cone, which is how they attached it.
I have never seen a fake of this style and the quality looks as it should from the pictures.
Best Wishes,
Bob

[Gregory Koepp]

well i still wish you luck, but for you sending me over to Dagger.com???? that right there should tell you not to ask such a question.

ok, look this is a fake post war eagle worth about 100.00 if they put that much in it? for them or you to say they changed up the molding every time or even changed alittle is non sense!! didn't happen nor would it! also for this being made because it was made for a office or something other is STUPID!! again NON-SENSE!

i have been there and done that, and this is not made the way it should be made, you need to search the internet and see for yourself. please i should not be the one showing it is real for you, but you to show why you think it is want you call it and why!. and i again wish you luck, because you won't find any real proof this eagle your showing is good. look i'm not telling this to you becuase i want it,,,, because i just sold a real one to a member here. i'm trying to save you from getting burned.

so good luck

greg

[Gregory Koepp]

please show me other eagles like this one in question that were on a building. no really i want to see the backs of the building eagles versa-RR eagle.

becuase there has to be some out there if you say so??? they should have the mounting cones and medal rods going through to secure them to the building with concrete or other material on the backing still? or are they all mint condition?

sure they made building eagles, and they made allot of them too, so please show me one on a building like this???

oh heres a good spot to start at, and this is just one of many sites you can search through:
http://www.thirdreichruins.com/reichsadler.htm
good luck

greg

[Robert H]

stay with your opinion and enjoy it

[Jarrid Marsh]

[quote=Gregory Koepp]well i still wish you luck, but for you sending me over to Dagger.com???? that right there should tell you not to ask such a question.

ok, look this is a fake post war eagle worth about 100.00 if they put that much in it? for them or you to say they changed up the molding every time or even changed alittle is non sense!! didn't happen nor would it! also for this being made because it was made for a office or something other is STUPID!! again NON-SENSE!

i have been there and done that, and this is not made the way it should be made, you need to search the internet and see for yourself. please i should not be the one showing it is real for you, but you to show why you think it is want you call it and why!. and i again wish you luck, because you won't find any real proof this eagle your showing is good. look i'm not telling this to you becuase i want it,,,, because i just sold a real one to a member here. i'm trying to save you from getting burned.

so good luck

greg




Hi Greg!!

First off 35" Eagles or Adlers are few and far between, secondly to make a call based on the pictures alone is not fair or any way to make an accurate assesment.

The bulk of these were manufactured based on the periodic tables listed on many, with the component Magnesium, although I dont see the marks here it stands to reason that its there. Magnesium is resistant to corrosion, this is why many of these birds, at least the front in many cases is without age or wear.

If one wanted to make such a bird, the cost is high and prohibitive for a fraudster, at best a call could be made with the bird in hand.

But to come on and post the critter is a fake is reckless and self serving and based on no evidence whatsoever, and therefore your comments are basically useless, and I have no idea how you have come to this conclusion.

So!! I will come back to your comment on STUPID!! and NON-SENSE! and I will apply what I know and apply it to your post.

Think before you type sir, and if you want to comment on something such as this, you should have access to it and not work on assumption.

Oops! I see the periodic table markings now

Have a nice day!

Jarrid

[Jarrid Marsh]

Quote: " The Railroad eagle, as collectors have labeled this Nazi symbol, was not solely used for train cars and rail engines specifically, but was a multi purpose plaque that was most likely found in many government offices, meeting halls, and dignitary rooms as well as many other places.

One only has to look at period photo's to observe that the Nazi Government's obsession with the eagle symbol, that they used it ubiquitously on all their flags, uniform, statues, and badges. Although these eagle plaques were for many purposes, we as collectors refer to them as the "Railroad Eagle", because this is where collectors have mostly viewed and associated this symbol to adorn, the Reichbahn trains of Nazi Germany.

This quote is from the 1st page of JR'S Book.

Quote #2

This reference is far from being the final word written on railroad eagles and the companies that were involved in manufacturing them. But at least its a start and time that information, data and specifics have been compiled that address some of the questions. In gathering information for the reference, many times I was limited to what photographic evidence and information that other collectors could provide me with.

This quote is the last page of JR'S book.

http://daggers.infopop.cc/groupee/fo...3/m/2890021704


The link posted above will also answer more questions.

So I would suggest, that since the Author clearly states that it not a final word on these eagle's, that some people should refrain from makeing statements of originality and using a reference that does not encompass all or complete data.

I suggest that anyone who has interest to purchase this book, and when making an opinion, taking the time to read it before making a final conclusion of originality.

J

[Gregory Koepp]

"But to come on and post the critter is a fake is reckless and self serving and based on no evidence whatsoever"

wait, first off nothing i said was reckless nor selfseving....

I have been researching these for many years now and have seen so many photos and read so many post and articales that it get's repetitive, but i still read them and keep searching for any new items out there as most collectors due. I could careless if he keep's or sell's this Eagle but do care if he asks for information and remarks then doesn't take any of it as to "maybe i need to see for myself" it is not always the person who answers the post who needs to prove these items are fake, but also the person who thinks these are real. NO ONE has came on here and look yourself allot of people have read this posting, and have not wanted to respond, why? because they are sick of being attacked because of what they post? or because they don't know? or they are not really sure? or they haven't seen one like this being proved as being real WW2 made? i can go on for awhile but you get what i'm saying. Look fakers are getting better all the time but for some reasons they leave some items alone? and fake other for some weard reason, and they have picked the Rail Road Eagle as one of their targets, now this could be made very easy and thats probably why they have picked on this item. the molding process is simple and the materal is easy to get and very cheap to make as they can buy a block of aluminum for $30.00 and make one and if they messed it up the first time they can reuse this same materal to try again. there is one good thing that they haven't got down yet and it is getting the items to properly mold and machine down the bolt and securing areas. now sure this can be done too but it will take more time and money, now this is were it get's to be costing to much to fake to make money on and to due the same molding the same time after time. that is where they have another problem at, and they get the moldings wrong.

I know some are not going to care what i say because they are not going to spend hours and hours days after day to look for any reason why this is fake or why it should be real??? i have tryed to put information out here for you to look up and prove to why you think this is real? i can show you many sites or? to see for yourself that this is a fake. if you have any proof this is real please post, please show me something that i can see and research.

thanks and take care,,,

greg

[Jarrid Marsh]

Greg,

Ok, 35' Birds are not common, and if it were made as a repo the cost is actually quite high, like 30k just to make the mold. If it were fake, to recoup the cost there would be 35' birds all over the place. And they are clearly not.

I just see your opinion as final, in reality I think in order to properly assess the originality one would need to have the bird in their hands, so I am sure you have some knowledge, but the mounting configuration is really what I consider to be unfinished, and a lot of people will not comment because they know little about them. JR's reference is a great guide, and it answers a lot of questions, but even as he states, further research needs to be done. And as far as I know he is still doing it..

Those lugs would need to be cut, and once cut a proper mounting could be applied, if you look at the 35' bird that JR has ntered in his book and look at the mounting configuration, you might see that it is quite possible to get there from here.

Appreciate your response, and if I came off abrubt I apologize. I would just like to see a little more discretion, as I cant tell, nor am I stateing with any certainty that the bird posted is correct, however it is quite possible.

If you have a link that shows a 35' repro bird? by all means post it.

Take care,

J

[Gregory Koepp]

first off JR's pamplet is nice he spent allot of time doing it but is lacking allot of stuff and is way to much for what it is. I have it and give him his due's but i did not learn anything from it.

for a mold as for this you can make in your own garage and cost you afew dollars at most, if your a molder. sure the real molds they might have spent 1/10th of your guess, not 30k ?????

look if you think it's real go to it and buy all that show up! but don't put your bank account in it because your going to get burned.

you ask me to show,??? no you show me real Eagles made like this! you can't and won't so look as you will, these fakes are out there and are mostly locked away in someones collection or sitting on the garage floor of the maker. your right there are not allot of them out there, because they know they look too fake to be taken as real eagles, so why would they waist their time making more when they can't make the money off of their creation.

one thing is for sure and that is "I DUE NOT BELEAVE THESE (THIS) IS REAL, SO IF YOU SHOW SOMETHING THAT CAN BE LOOKED INTO MORE PLEASE LET ME KNOW" other wise i will leave this alone.

thanks and GOODLUCK proving this is what you want it to be.

takecare,,,,,,

greg

[Jarrid Marsh]

Greg,

Thats your opinion, your other post seemed to be a statement of fact. And when you make a statement of fact, then the burden is on you. Opinions are fine. So we can leave it at that.

I would want to see the bird personally before I made an opinion, but if your confident enough with pictures? that is fine as well.

If it is a fake, I would imagine we will see more in the future.

But lets this dog lie as it is, no sense in trying to change each other's opinions. Lets just not forget that they are just that, "opinion's"

Kind Regards,

J

[Jon Fish]

Must admit it doesn't tick the box's for me either ,those cast lugs look awfull .I also have JR's book and would say it was a great effort,but even JR said in the book if was not definitive but a good starting point
I'd rather buy one of the textbook ones.

[JR.]

Greg, I have 3 updates on new makers that were discovered in the last 7 months, but since you already know everything I'm sure that they won't be of interest to you. And if you believe that my reference is over priced and you didn't learn anything from it, then by all means send it back and I'll give you a refund. In order to make the reference better in the future, please send me the photos of all of the eagle that you have owned and any information that I can include in future copies for collectors.

[bbeck]

Eagles

How rare are the 26" birds?

[bbeck]

Ok maybe it is a 27 inch eagle...

[bahnschutz1]

Greg, I have 3 updates on new makers that were discovered in the last 7 months, but since you already know everything I'm sure that they won't be of interest to you. And if you believe that my reference is over priced and you didn't learn anything from it, then by all means send it back and I'll give you a refund. In order to make the reference better in the future, please send me the photos of all of the eagle that you have owned and any information that I can include in future copies for collectors.